http://www.associationofcatholicpriests.ie/constitution/ The 'democratisation' of the Catholic Church - in effect the Church becomes like the protestant sects. Stuff straight from the bowels of hell but of course they do not believe in hell. They are most definitely not orthodox Catholics.
I was reading their website and it appears they endorse Mary McAleese, which can't be a good sign given her views on same-sex marriage and other fundamental doctrine in the Church
Be informed of what is happening in the Church - the AUSCP (Association of U.S. Catholic Priests) is linked with the NFPC (Nat'l Federal of Priest Council)! All it takes is a little searching on the internet and you will find out what the agenda is. Here was the agenda for the last meeting in St. Louis June 23-26: social justice; ordaining married men, supporting the Catholic Common Ground Initiative; opening up the process of selecting bishops and setting up a process to help with the next translation of the Roman Missal. If you don't know about any of these agendas, I suggest you look into it. All these dissenting organizations trace back to "Call to Action". Pray much for our Church! My heart hurts!!!
Pope Francis on the family synod: 'We need prayers, not gossip' By Elise Harris Vatican City, Mar 25, 2015 / 07:10 am (EWTN News/CNA) During his weekly general audience Pope Francis spoke about the gift and call of the Christian family, and urged attendees to pray for the intentions of the upcoming Synod of Bishops on the family. “The Church needs a prayer full of love for the family and for life,” the Pope told pilgrims gathered in a drizzly St. Peter's Square for his March 25 general audience. “Because of this, I ask you to pray insistently for the next Synod of Bishops, on the family, so that the Church is increasingly more committed and unified in her witness of the love and mercy of God with all families,” he said. Francis emphasized that ahead of the October meeting, which will gather more than 200 Bishops and representatives from all over the world, “we (the Church) need prayers, not gossip,” and asked that “those also pray who feel alienated or are not accustomed to praying.” The Pope’s petition for prayer took place during his continued catechesis on the family – a theme he announced last fall would be the subject of every general audience leading up to this year’s synod of bishops as a means of preparation. After last year’s Extraordinary Synod of Bishops on the Family, which explored the theme “the Pastoral Challenges of the Family in the Context of Evangelization,” set the groundwork, this year’s Ordinary Synod on the Family will wrap-up the synodal discussion. Set to take place Oct. 4-25, this year’s ordinary synod will reflect on the theme “Jesus Christ reveals the mystery and vocation of the family.” The conclusions of the gathering will be used by Pope Francis to draft his first Post-Synodal Exhortation, which can be expected in 2016. In his audience address, Francis noted how the day marked the feast of the Annunciation, which commemorates the Archangel Gabriel’s announcement to Mary that she would be the Mother of God. The solemnity, he said, “invites us, in the context of the Church’s preparation for the forthcoming Synod on the Family, to consider the relationship between the Incarnation and the mission of the family.” With Gabriel’s announcement, “the Lord illuminates and strengthens the faith of Mary, as her husband Joseph will do later, so that Jesus is born and welcomed into the warmth of a family,” the Pope explained. He also pointed out how March 25 celebrates the Day for Life and the 20th anniversary of John Paul II’s encyclical “Evangelium Vitae,” which the saint authored in 1995 emphasizing the sacredness and value of human life. The family plays a central role in the encyclical, Francis said, noting that from the beginning of time God blessed man and woman and entrusted them with the task of procreating and forming “a community of love to transmit life.” In the sacrament of marriage Christian spouses commit themselves with this task for life, the Pope said, noting that it is the responsibility of the Church to accompany and support families, especially those most in need. When a couple is married, he said, “the Church, for her part, is obliged not to abandon the new family, not even when it moves away or falls into sin, always calling it to conversion and reconciliation in the Lord.” However, in order to carry out this mission, the Church needs loving prayers in support of both life and the family, Francis noted, particularly for the Synod of Bishops on the Family. “I ask you to continue praying for the Synod, so that it will reflect the compassion of the Good Shepherd for his flock and help the Church to be ever more committed and clear in her witness to the truth of God’s merciful love for all families,” he said. Francis closed his speech with this appeal for prayer, and went on to greet groups of pilgrims present from various countries around the world. Among those in attendance at the Pope’s audience was Mike Haines, the brother of British aid-worker David Haines, who was murdered by ISIS after being kidnapped while working near the Syrian border with Turkey in 2013. In a news conference ahead of Wednesday’s audience, British Ambassador to the Holy See Nigel Baker said that Mike Haines “will be bringing to the Vatican his message of interreligious understanding.” “Pope Francis has called for a common commitment to end fighting, hatred and violence. Mike Haines is living that commitment in an extraordinary way.” Haines was accompanied to the papal audience by Imam Shahnawaz Haque, from East London. Archbishop Joseph Coutts of Karachi, Pakistan, was also present during the audience, and exchanged a long handshake and several words the Pope after the event was over. Numerous attacks against Christians have taken place in Pakistan in recent months, the most recent being a suicide bombing on two Christian churches March 15.
Any ideas about this from the USA Gang?: “Vatican Abruptly Ends Overhaul of American Nuns” http://www.newsmax.com/US/EU-REL-Vatican-US-Sisters/2015/04/16/id/638874/ I know next to nothing about the LCWR but I’m guessing they have resorted to the same tactics that their “Sisters” in the Democrat Left use when they consider themselves “under attack”. That is Hoot-n-Holler about bigotry, misogyny and Dirty Old Men. And as seems to be the case with the Gay Agenda, the “Bigs” in the Catholic Church would rather “Cave” than uphold principles of The Faith! GOD SAVE THE USA AND ALL HERE!!
I find this news very interesting. Although many on this forum have different views on this matter, I have been rather negative about Cardinal Muller's approach as head of the CDF. Particularly what he has been doing regarding Medjugorje but also regarding the Synod and yes, this investigation of the US consecrated women. For me, his approach to all these matters has been heavy handed and somewhat harsh. This latest news indicates Pope Francis' approach has won the day over Cardinal Muller's approach. I believe this is good news. Here is the Vatican press release on the matter (dated today): http://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2015/04/16/0278/00617.html
It is interesting how very good, holy ,sincere Catholics can disagree over these things. I have no doubt something big is heading towards us in September. October. But after the last synod rejected by a huge majority devilish goings on, I am a little less worried.
You're joking, right? He's one of the few good guys with his head still on straight. I've been very pleasantly surprised to see him step up to the plate and actually Defend the Faith.
No, Brian, not joking. I realise that you and Mac and 'traditionalists' in general find in Cardinals Muller and Burke a total agreement in approach but it's not an approach for me and I don't believe it is an approach with which Pope Francis particularly sympathises. I'm hoping that underneath that Germanic approach of Cardinal Muller there is a softer heart and his involvement in the changed approach to the women religious suggests that might be the case. My biggest problem with Cardinal Muller is with respect to his apparent actions regarding Medjugorje. But it is possible that the negative information that has been distributed does not accurately represent his position. So far, I have not read any document from Cardinal Muller himself, only from other hierarchy who claim to be acting on the Cardinal's behalf.
It's not a difference in approach. It's orthodoxy versus heterodoxy. And the dissent and disobedience of the LCWR doesn't require a different approach, it requires defending the Faith from attack, an attack the LCWR has fine tuned for decades and for which it has never repented or changed its evil ways. Yes, evil. We live in an age that demands clarity of thought and plain speech.
We are like those on tv who give opinions without knowing whats going on in the the background. I think the nuns gave in and agreed to calm down. I am sure they came to some agreement. Those nuns are a dying breed...they are just the loudest. Brother al
Is there evidence to support that view, or is that just your own impression? (Genuine question, I'm not being confrontational here.)
I am no expert on what or who the Holy Father , 'Sides with'. But I wonder if it is possible Pope Francis does not take, 'Sides', at least as we know it? He is a Jesuit and that says a lot in itself. I remember someone saying one time if you put 10 Jesuits in a room you will get 10 radical differing points of view. But these people are very,very well educated intellectuals and so can accomodate divergent differences in a way most of the rest of us just cannot. They kind of open the windows of their hearts and minds to everyone's point of view and through this process of opening hearts and minds arrive at a very rounded view of what the truth is. I think you need really great integrity and humility for this. I see this process work out on this forum you know too, were you get a widely expressed range of views. But it really does take a lot of charity and patience for this. For instance because someone had a radically different view of things than ourselves , not to at once think that person is somehow bad or evil or ill intentioned. I think one thing reading posts here has taught me is lots and lots of humility. I have been proved wrong (to myself at least) over and over and over again. But this does not make me sad , I just think it is so positive , for if I did not get my balloon punctures so often I would swell up and float away to the wild blue yonder. Of course there is a bottom line and I do have firm opinions, but never so firm , apart from Dogma and Truths I cannot open my heart to listen. But you can see were the Holy Father with this approach of huge openness can be very, very unsettling to many people. But one of his great roles is that of teacher and all the very best teachers unsettle rather than bore. I often find he unsettles me, but this is kinda nice , like a roller ride. I try to keep my heart open myself, though the hinges of the door are a bit rusty, maybe.
"Let us keep our minds open by all means, as long as that means keeping our sense of perspective and seeking an understanding of the forces which mould the world. But don’t keep your minds so open that your brains fall out! There are still things in this world which are true and things which are false; acts which are right and acts which are wrong, even if there are statesmen who hide their designs under the cloak of high-sounding phrases."
Trying to mediate a little here between the opposing points of view in this thread, there would seem to be a need to distinguish between questions of content and tone. I haven't followed the LCWR/CDF controversy in great detail, but I do know something about the case of Sr Elizabeth A Johnson CSJ who became the bone of contention in the conflict ( which pre-dates Cardinal Müller), and have read a fair amount of her work as well as a book based on a (critical) doctoral thesis about her. The basic theological issue here is that there seem to be two different ideas of what theological research should be about: EAJ represents the university tradition of 'free inquiry' without doctrinal presuppositions, whereas obviously the CDF's role is to act as a guardian of orthodoxy. The conflict began in earnest when the US bishops, led by Cardinal Wuerl, issued serious criticisms of Elizabeth Johnson's theology, in response to which the LCWR dug their heels in behind her because they felt that the bishops were being dictatorial (read: acting like a boys' club). The problem is that I can see both sides of the argument. On the theological level there is no doubt that the bishops were right to a large extent. On the other it has to be admitted that, intellectually, EAJ is a top-drawer thinker of considerable creativity and that some of her ideas - when not straying from orthodoxy - are actually quite brilliant. I'm thinking of certain notions of the interplay of law and free improvisation in God's creation, or the contemporary reading of some aspects of Aquinas. To this extent she somewhat resembles Karl Rahner, in that in her theology there is a mixture of the good and the dubious which requires sifting. The tactical question when it comes to conflict resolution in situations like this would seem to be one of approach. One line sometimes taken by the Church has simply been to issue apodictic decrees of censure against heresy, but historically this has tended to be counter-productive, as that tends to create intellectual martyrs. Punitive action, even if justifiable in absolute terms, often reinforces the feeling in some quarters that the Church is being obscurantist, (Galileo is the classic case here, Alfred Loisy in the 'Modernist' crisis at the beginning of the 20th century being another) thereby actually strengthening the liberals' hand by handing them ammunition. Labelling liberals 'disobedient' may be factually accurate, but is not necessarily helpful in terms of winning them back. An alternative and IMHO far more successful strategy is constructive engagement, rather than blanket condemnation, though without doctrinal capitulation. 'In all things, charity'... My sense is that this is the line that the CDF has chosen towards the LCWR - as Benedict XVI did towards the SSPX at the other end of the theological spectrum - , and they should be applauded for it.
Yes, and I think that Francis, coming from his personal experience of living among the "sheep" of the barrios could especially appreciate how the Church, in its highest echelons of authority, can easily be seen within such a miserable existence as purely Pharisaical where it again places heavy burdens upon the little ones without lifting many fingers to help them carry those added burdens. And those "little ones of the Faith" already live a life itself that has placed many fears of authority upon them in the secular world. The Church then should indeed be seen as a place of refuge/"hospital" of mercy for those living in a dirty separate world/sheep pen....far from those shepherds who could never be seen as willing to "smell like them" by entering into their every day misery. If one is so blind to not even agree to the huge benefits to the entire Church and beyond of Medjugorje, giving the impression that such change in people (esp. when they are so easily "corralled" into the pens of the confessional...talk about orthodoxy's own failure there) might even be somehow detrimental to their Faith, and again, placing those heavy burdens upon those who may not be able to travel there themselves.....well, then such authority itself needs to comply with its own, more compassionate higher authority, as a check on its own humility or lack thereof.
P.S. Interesting too how two Germans within the hierarchy and in the news of late present such individually strong but divergent attempts to aid the Faithful.....one seeming to fulfill the typical German stereotype while the other seeming to display a counter to that stereotype.
It is so true there is a bottom line. It is maybe like me walking my dogs, they re great fierce Japanese Akita's and so I know some times I can let them of the lead and sometimes I cannot. I am just saying that Pope Francis has his own kinda dogs and has made his own decisions of when and how much he can let people of the lead to wander about. Each dog owner has his own ideas. But he is Pope and I am not, thank God. I guess I just have to give him a large degree of trust and loyalty in this. His vocation , his path, is not an easy one.
Yes there are many different ways of cooking eggs. I doubt there is any pure, right' one. It is a lot about trust. Either we extend this trust or we do not. I have decided to trust. I do not always find this easy but it is what I do. If i were Pope I would be excommunicating left right and centre. But a fire and brimstone kinda guy is maybe not what God needs. I would certainly be kicking ass big time. But I am happy enough to trust.
I think we are living through the 'last drops of the era of Divine Mercy'. The world needs to hear the message of Divine Mercy before Christ comes as a just judge.
