Pope tells gay man: 'God made you like this'

Discussion in 'Church Critique' started by BrianK, May 21, 2018.

  1. AED

    AED Powers

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    I have a similar story from my cousin. He left the church for many years. We have no idea how bad it was. Maybe is.
     
  2. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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  3. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

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    garabandal,

    This is the same method that is being used to promote a "Yes" vote on the referendum to the 8th amendment in your country. The following is from the article that you posted,

    Müller suggested that those who want to see Humanae Vitae weakened often begin with the hardest cases, in order to play on emotions.

    I believe that this method is used quite often to get people to submit to things that they would normally not agree with, in addition, it is also used to put people on the spot and have them say things that can be taken out of context.


    US businesses have been requiring their employees to attend these types of inclusive classes also. I remember when employees simply respected each other and either did their job or they were fired, simple.

    In addition, I agree with Carpediemptf that the sexual revolution of the 60's and the 70's is a big cause of what we are currently witnessing in the world. It is like we are reliving it but it is more integrated into our society now and it would greatly shock me if Bl. Emmerich's prophecies are still years and years away but of course, it's God's timing.


    I saw a story on the news the other day about a female Cornell (Ivy League) student and I just found this article which discusses the story and goes on to explain what most of us know already - that our children are being indoctrinated into this liberal way of thinking in the public school systems and I agree with what this author states in regard to colleges and universities also, "Sending your child to college is playing Russian roulette with their values". Imho, it is all directly related to the fact that we have almost entirely removed God from our classrooms and our society.

    Cornell Student Presents Senior Thesis In Her Underwear
    Dennis Prager Posted: May 15, 2018 https://townhall.com/columnists/den...sents-senior-thesis-in-her-underwear-n2480750

    The most remarkable thing about the title of this column, “Cornell student presents senior thesis in her underwear” is that not one reader thinks it’s a joke.

    That, my friends, is further proof of the low esteem in which most Americans hold our universities.

    The left has rendered our universities, in the description of Harvard Professor Steven Pinker, a laughingstock.

    As reported in the Cornell Sun and then around the world, this is what actually happened last week at Cornell University, one of our “Ivy League” universities:

    Letitia Chai, a Cornell senior, presented a trial run of her college scholar senior thesis wearing a blue button-down shirt and cutoff jean shorts. Her professor, Rebekah Maggor, asked her, “Is that really what you would wear?”

    The professor went on to say that Chai’s shorts were “too short” – that as a speaker she was making a “statement” with the clothes she was wearing.

    As reported in the Cornell newspaper, “The class does not have a formalized dress code, but asks students to ‘dress appropriately for the persona [they] will present.’”

    Offended and hurt by the professor’s suggestion, Chai decided that she would present her thesis in even less clothing. She appeared before her fellow students in her shirt and shorts and then removed them. As she stripped down to a bra and panties, she explained:


    “I am more than Asian. I am more than a woman. I am more than Letitia Chai. I am a human being, and I ask you to take this leap of faith, to take this next step – or rather, this next strip – in our movement and to join me in revealing to each other and seeing each other for who we truly are: members of the human race. We are so triumphant, but most importantly, we are equals.”

    Twenty-eight of the 44 audience members followed suit – stripping down to their underwear with her.

    Chai’s presentation was livestreamed. It can still be seen on Facebook.

    Eleven students who were present wrote a long statement defending both the professor – who apologized profusely – and Chai.

    “As students who firmly believe in the tenants [that Cornell students do not know the word is “tenets,” not “tenants,” is not surprising] of justice and the commitment to fair representation, we feel that it is our duty to make the following statement. We support Letitia’s commitment to the cause of women’s rights. . . .

    “We strongly support and identify with Letitia’s fight for equality in the treatment of all people, regardless of race, gender, color, creed, sexuality, or appearance. The majority of us are students of color, from multiethnic backgrounds, who very much relate to Letitia’s frustration with systemic oppression that is part of the fabric of this country. . . .

    “Our recollection of that day is as follows: Letitia stood up to give her speech. Before she began, our professor asked Letitia if she would wear ‘those shorts’ to her actual presentation on Saturday. Our professor regularly asks all of the students, male and female, such questions to clarify appropriate attire for public speaking. Our professor went on to say that what you wear and how you present yourself make a statement. She noted that if you were to wear jean shorts to your thesis presentation, that is a statement. Her focus on attire was a means of noting the importance of professionalism in certain public speaking situations. . . .

    “Throughout the semester . . . we have also had several meaningful dialogues on privilege, discussed how to avoid (white) savior narratives. . . .

    “Our professor . . . often illustrates the ways to us in which society can institute a socialized behavior (for females, acting apologetic for opinions) due to systematic oppression. . . .”

    It’s hard to know which aspect of this story is the most ludicrous and the most disturbing.

    Is it the students stripping down to their underwear?

    That delivering a senior thesis in one’s underwear before fellow students, most of whom also stripped down to their underwear, is acceptable – even honored – at Cornell University tells you just about all you need to know to understand the degraded state of Cornell and most other American universities. And if delivering a senior thesis in one’s underwear is a blow for women’s equality, why wear underwear? Why not deliver the thesis while naked?”

    Is it the pervasive assumption of America’s “systemic oppression” of women and ethnic minorities?

    If there are luckier young women in the world than those who attend Cornell and other American universities, it is hard to imagine who they might be. Yet, they have been so effectively indoctrinated by their left-wing instructors in elementary school, high school, and college, they walk around thinking of themselves as victims – of “systemic oppression” in what is probably the freest and most opportunity-giving society in human history.

    Or is it the apparent absence of any criticism of Chai from even one of the 1,995 faculty members of Cornell University?

    It is inconceivable that even at Cornell, there is not one faculty member who found this young woman’s behavior an insult to Cornell and to the once-exalted field of higher education. Yet, they so fear their left-wing colleagues and left-wing students, they have said nothing.

    This story reconfirms what I regularly tell parents: Sending your child to college is playing Russian roulette with their values.

    ****

    Here is another article about this "Cornell" story. Btw, I keep noticing that it has become commonplace for women newscasters to dress in a very unprofessional manner imho,

    View attachment 7966
    Student strips to underwear during presentation to protest criticism from prof, and gets an apology!
    A senior at Cornell University delivered her thesis presentation in just her bra and …
    BizPac Review May 16, 2018
     
  4. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

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    That's where moral relativism takes you. You don't know where you are. You have nothing solid to which to refer any situation whatsoever and eventually have no choice but to accept anything and are obligated to apologise for not realising the 'truth' sooner.
     
  5. Blizzard

    Blizzard thy kingdom come

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    Moral Relativism (or Ethical Relativism) is the position that moral or ethical propositions do not reflect objective and/or universal moral truths, but instead make claims relative to social, cultural, historical or personal circumstances.

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. AED

    AED Powers

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    You can't make this stuff up. We are living in a world where the inmates are running the asylum. "God first makes mad those He wishes to destroy"--an old saying that goes back to Ancient Greece. Well here we are.
     
  7. Blizzard

    Blizzard thy kingdom come

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    What is truly amazing is that several popes, saints and messages from heaven stated clearly that moral relativism and modernism were the real enemies and would one day devastate the church and societies.

    And yet here we are: we saw the train approaching from miles away at great speed and we just stood on the tracks unable to move waiting to be hit.

    [​IMG]

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  8. AED

    AED Powers

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    So right Blizzard. Good image of the train. I used to say that back a few decades that we could feel the vibration on the tracks. But now it is bearing down on us with great speed.
     
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  9. DeGaulle

    DeGaulle Powers

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    People don't need God, or the gods, to make themselves mad, they are doing a fine job all by themselves (although satan has a considerable input behind the scenes).
     
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  10. BrianK

    BrianK Guest

    Oops, there’s push back against the pope’s homoheresy, better say something that sounds orthodox so Joe-six-pack Catholic can go back to sleep in the pews.


    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-pope-homosexuality/pope-tells-bishops-not-to-accept-gay-seminarians-report

    Pope tells bishops not to accept gay seminarians: report

    VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Pope Francis warned Italian bishops this week to vet carefully applicants to the priesthood and reject anyone they suspected might be homosexual, local media reported on Thursday.

    “Keep an eye on the admissions to seminaries, keep your eyes open,” the pope was quoted as saying by newspaper La Stampa’s Vatican Insider service. “If in doubt, better not let them enter.”

    The Vatican did not immediately respond to a request for a comment on the remarks, which Vatican Insider and Il Messaggero said were made at a closed-door gathering on Monday.

    Francis’s meeting with Italian bishops came just a day after a Chilean man who suffered clerical sexual abuse quoted the pope as telling him in a private conversation that God had made him gay and loved him that way.

    The Vatican declined to comment on the report which touched off fierce media speculation that Francis was softening the Church stance on homosexuality. It has previously condemned homosexuality as an immoral disorder if actively practised.

    In a 2005 document, released under Francis’s predecessor Pope Benedict, the Vatican said the Church could admit into the priesthood those who had clearly overcome homosexual tendencies for at least three years.

    But it said practicing homosexuals and those with “deep-seated” gay tendencies and those who support a gay culture should be barred.

    The reported comments to the bishops might appease conservatives who have grown alarmed at the way Francis has dramatically shifted the language the Church has used about homosexuality since his election in 2013.

    “If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge?” the pope said on his first overseas trip in 2013. In 2016, he said he had ministered to people with unfulfilled homosexual tendencies as well as homosexuals who were not able to remain chaste, as the Church asks them to.

    “When a person arrives before Jesus, Jesus certainly will not say: ‘Go away because you are homosexual’,” he said.

    Pope Benedict wrote in 2005 that homosexuality was “a strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil”.

    Reporting by Crispian Balmer; Editing by Matthew Mpoke Bigg
     
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  11. AED

    AED Powers

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    I hate to be cynical but that thought did occur to me.
     
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  12. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    But this was also engineered by the freemasons/communists.
     
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  13. SgCatholic

    SgCatholic Guest

    I can't remember which member here mentioned this video, which exposes how societal breakdown in the USA was planned.

     
  14. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    Choosing sin , especially a gravely evil lifestyle is itself be definition insane. Nor is the insanity we enter into static, we end up more and more insane as time goes along. Both as a Society and as individuals. Being sane is about being in touch with God who is the Universal and total reality. Hell is effectively the Greatest Insane reality. It is in the nature of the insane to adjudge those who are sane as being the insane ones and this is what is currently happening. I have lost count of the amount of times people whom I talk to stare at me with open mouthed horror when I put forward my own views on things. It is as though I am Dr Frankenstein.:):)

    The irony is that these poor insane people regard themselves as being , 'Free'. When they are in fact nuts.
    In fact it is the nuttiest of the nuts who are running the Lunatic Asylums we call Nation States.

    For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. (Romans 1:21-23)



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    Last edited: May 25, 2018
  15. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    Pope Francis is of course insane. You can tell this by his erratic statements and behavior.

    Mad as a hatter.

    Folks try very earnestly to make some sense of his various goings on when there just isn't any. This is the path to winding up nuts yourself.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

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    Sg, Thank you for posting this, I hadn't seen it before.

    ****
    Edited to add:



    Imho the following is another example of how big this problem that we are discussing on this thread is in our society. I really would not have considered that the following story is more evidence of this problem unless I was in the midst of reading about the crisis in the Chilean Church but it does in fact appear to be just that,

    Did the Boy Scouts of America Implement a New Policy Requiring Condoms to Be Available at Jamboree?
    The policy has been in place for years and is not connected to BSA's decision to include girls. May 23, 2018

    https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/boy-scouts-condoms-jamboree/
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2018
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  17. Jarg

    Jarg Archangels

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    In response to the pope's supposed comment, some priests are speaking up with the clarity of the Church´s Magisterium. This was the newsletter distributed by Courage Roman Catholic Apostolate this week.

    "Does God Make People 'Gay'?"
    Fr. Philip Bochanski, the Executive Director of Courage, addresses this challenging question in this short clip:



    To learn more, watch the entire talk from which the above clip was excerpted. Fr. Bochanski gave this presentation on Christian anthropology and sexual ethics as they relate to the experience of same-sex attractions at a 2016 Clergy Study Day.

     
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  18. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

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    Learning the Lessons of Chile
    Fr. Gerald E. Murray Thursday, May 24, 2018 https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2018/05/24/learning-the-lessons-of-chile/

    Note: One week until our 10th anniversary! If you still need convincing, click on my letter here. But really, you don’t
    want to miss this chance to be part of helping
    The Catholic Thing keep going for another ten years, do you? – Robert Royal

    The surprise announcement by all the bishops of Chile of their submissions of resignations to Pope Francis is a stunning development. I did live television commentary for the Brooklyn Diocese’s NET TV of Pope Francis’ January apostolic voyage to Chile and Peru. At that time, we discussed, at length, the pope’s strong rebuke of people who accused Bishop Juan Barros of having enabled the sexual abuse of minors by his friend and mentor Fr. Fernando Karadima.

    Five months later, the entire Chilean Bishops’ Conference, after a three-day meeting in Rome with Pope Francis, concluded that their collective departure would please him, and would allow him the greatest freedom to rebuild the confidence of Chilean Catholics by installing new bishops throughout the country. How did we arrive at this point?

    At the press conference announcing the mass resignation, Bishop Fernando Reyes, the Secretary General of the Chilean Episcopal Conference, said:

    In this context of dialogue and discernment, various suggestions were presented as to how to deal with this great crisis, and furthermore the idea developed that, in order to be more in tune with the will of the Holy Father, it was appropriate to declare our absolute readiness to place our pastoral charges in the hands of the pope. In this way, we were able to make a collegial gesture of solidarity to take responsibility – not without sorrow – for the grave things that occurred, and so that the Holy Father could freely decide how to proceed regarding all of us.​

    The Chilean bishops seem to have thought that the pope wanted their resignations. This turn of events was unthinkable back in January. What happened? Outrage by victims of sexual abuse and by ordinary Catholics exploded in Chile, combined with persistent media coverage of this conflict.

    The pope took to heart the vehement reactions to his dismissive comments. He sent two outside investigators to Chile to gather evidence and report back. Then he called the Chilean hierarchy to Rome.

    He then laid out the evidence gathered by his investigators in a letter (later leaked to the press) given to the Chilean bishops when they arrived in Rome. The manifest wrongdoing cited by the pope rings true, given similar experiences in other countries: destruction of evidence; transfer of accused priests without concern for the minors who would come under their influence; delaying tactics and superficial or non-existent investigations of complaints received, pressure put upon those carrying out the canonical investigation of alleged crimes; and the placement by bishops and religious superiors of priests suspected of being active homosexuals in seminaries and novitiates.

    The investigators, it’s no surprise, discovered this familiar pattern in Chile. The self-reporting to Rome by the Chilean hierarchy in these matters was gravely deficient and even deceptive.

    [​IMG]
    Pope Francis with the Chilean bishops

    The lesson here is clear: if the Holy See wants to root out the sexual abuse of minors by clergy, and also put an end to the associated cover-ups by senior clergy and bishops, then it must use the same means in other places that it used here. Vatican designated investigators with no ties to the local church under investigation should be sent to gather evidence when complaints of sexual abuse and cover-ups are received.

    The self-policing and self-reporting system has been shown to be completely inadequate in the Chilean case. The effectiveness of canonical provisions governing the handling of accusations of sexual abuse of minors by priests depends on the full and vigorous cooperation of the local hierarchy. Absent that co-operation justice is not done. Such co-operation is often absent.

    The sad reality is that the exposure of the crime of sexual abuse of minors and the widespread efforts by bishops and religious order superiors to hide the facts from the public was not the result of actions initiated by the Church herself. That exposure came by way of the police, the courts, and the media in various countries.

    In the case of Chile, victims of sexual abuse only got a fair hearing in Rome by insisting on the truth of their claims in the face of both episcopal and papal rejection. Pope Francis decided to have another look at the matter and what he discovered is that he had not been given the complete story.

    He should also review the record of the various Roman curial departments that were involved in monitoring the situation in Chile for the past thirty years. The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith found Fr. Karadima guilty in 2011 of the sexual abuse of minors. He was forbidden to exercise priestly ministry and commanded to lead a live of prayer and penance. He is reported to still claim his innocence. Was this enough?

    By not removing him from the priesthood and returning him to the lay state, the gravity of his crimes was not sufficiently recognized. As in the case of Fr. Marcial Maciel, who also was not removed from priesthood despite his multiple and grave crimes, a life of prayer and penance becomes the functional equivalent of forced retirement and does not deprive the sexual predator of the state of life that allowed him to have easy access to his victims.

    Removal from the priesthood unmistakably rebukes him for the grave offense he has given to Christ and to Christ’s little ones, and also clearly communicates to the whole world that the Church considers him to have completely forfeited his right to exercise the office of the priesthood that he so badly misused.

    Roman action on Chile was necessary and purgative. The Church’s mission is to uphold the Gospel. That includes doing all that is possible to protect the innocent and punish the guilty. This is not vengeance. This is justice.

    And now is the time to take a similar look at other countries where there remain similar questions about the proper handling of accusations of sexual abuse and cover-ups.
     
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  19. Carol55

    Carol55 Ave Maria

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    I think the following article is related to the topic of this thread in addition to so many others on MOG,

    The Final and Mother of All Battles
    by Ted Flynn | May 24, 2018 https://www.sign.org/articles/final-mother-battles
    [​IMG]

    Playing out in many families in America seems to be some sort of crisis, or at least a dysfunction. What we are witnessing today is the manifestation of several generations of Americans with at least half the population trying to push a world-view, which voids the presence of God. The fruit of that thinking is what we are watching today in real time on television, schoolrooms, and all forms of media. At the 2012 Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, North Carolina, when God was brought up as a party platform, more than half of the capacity filled arena booed God off stage.

    The Illinois State Senate recently passed a bill legalizing medical marijuana on the grounds of elementary and middle school ground. One doesn’t need to be a PhD in sociology to see where this is headed. All that is needed for the bill to become law is the signature of the governor. Common sense is not commonly found.

    Everything seems to be percolating towards an event. What that is no one seems to know for sure, but nonetheless, people are anxious. It is now obvious the baby boomers have lived beyond their means with a Federal Reserve that prints money out of thin air enabling a life style in its twilight.

    But, the battle inside the family and what constitutes a family is larger than all other battles put together. Why? When a family loses its moral structure, everything important is lost. Sociologists and historians agree an intact nuclear family is the glue of all societies. The rock of all civilization is a strong family. Studies have clearly shown that strong marriages create emotionally healthy motivated children who grow up to become well-adjusted adults who themselves marry and have strong families.

    If Satan wanted to destroy all of mankind, it would make sense that he would go to the heart of God’s creation. Under the guidance of Saint John Paul II, the Church saw the establishment of the Pontifical Institute for the Studies on Marriage and the Family. Pope John Paul II said marriage was the bedrock of civilization, expressing these views early in his pontificate with his writings on The Theology of the Body. This was an area where he had primary interest since his canoe and camping trips with youth while a young priest in Poland. Cardinal Carlo Caffarra of Bologna was involved with this new Institute. Cardinal Caffara wrote Sister Lucy of Fatima asking for her prayers on the Institute not really expecting an answer back.

    In 2008, what she said to Cardinal Caffarra became known through the Institute archives and the correspondence he had with Sister Lucy of Fatima. Sister Lucy wrote back, “The final battle between the Lord and the reign of Satan will be about marriage and the family. Don’t be afraid. Anyone who operates for the sanctity of marriage will always be contended and opposed in every way because this is the decisive issue. However, Our Lady has already crushed its head.”

    Here Sister Lucy is speaking of Revelation, “And a great portent appeared in heaven, a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars; she was with child and she cried out in her pangs of birth, in anguish for delivery…” (12:1). It is the Blessed Mother who crushes the head of the serpent. Something immediately prior to Revelation 12:1 is Revelation 11:19. “Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen within his temple; and there were flashes of lightening, loud noise, peals of thunder, an earthquake, and heavy hail.”

    Just prior to the woman clothed with the sun appearing is chaos in the world. As the Ark of the New Covenant, it will be the actions of Our Lady that crush the head of the serpent. Sister Lucy is saying it is a fait d’accompli – it is already done. The chaos we are seeing around us shows that Satan knows his time is short and is doing everything possible to disrupt God’s creation. Even in previous pagan civilizations, homosexuality was never seen as normal behavior. However, we see an assault like never before through every social medium available to normalize this behavior. Looking back, Humanae Vitae was prophetic when one looks at the abuse to natural law alone.

    A seasoned OB/GYN will tell you what happens before a birth. First, the woman just wants to birth the child and be done with it. After nine beautiful months, she is ready and wants to give birth. Second, the woman about to give birth is in extreme discomfort. The pain is excruciating with the birth pangs. Pangs of birth where the pain of delivery confirms the sin of Adam, “Woman will have pain in childbirth.” Third, while a woman is pushing and grunting, she may wonder if she could die. There is a fear of death that she may not be able to accomplish this. She is the only one who can see this through. There is often yelling, screaming, apprehension, and exhaustion. When the child is born, it is as if the pain was never there. It is forgotten as she holds her newborn. In a moment, the agony turns to ecstasy.

    We are presently witnessing the dawn and birth of a New Era, The New Times, The Fullness of Time, a New Jerusalem, or as Saint John Paul II said, a New Springtime, with the attendant pain prior to a birth of a child. The confusion and lack of discipline we see in the Church and culture today is systemic chaos. Before the child arrives is a time of uncertainty and normal human anxiety because the old and familiar is being swept away, and the new is on the horizon. Major prophecy and church approved apparitions sites are pointing to this. Cardinal Raymond Burke and several other leading cardinals and bishops have said there are many events pointing to the fact that we may be living in the days spoken of in Scripture. The Blessed Mother is saying those proclaiming the Word of God are now the Apostles of the Last Times. Saint Louis de Montfort said it will be Marian lay people who will carry the Church through the challenges it faces. Has any battle ever been bigger?

    Our times are unique. Cardinal Karol Wojtyla (Saint John Paul II) gave an address at the Eucharistic Congress in 1976 in Philadelphia for the Bicentennial Celebration of the Unites States and said:

    “We are now standing in the face of the greatest historical confrontation humanity has ever experienced. I do not think that the wide circle of the American society, or the wide circle of the Christian community realize this fully. We are now facing the final confrontation between the Church and the anti-church, between the gospel and the anti-gospel. The confrontation lies within the plans of Divine Providence. It is, therefore, in God’s plan, and it must be a trial which the Church must take up, and face courageously…”

    This was said over forty years ago, and it appears the confluence of events has risen to a fever pitch with Satan knowing his time is short. Thus we see the pain around us. In the Church we see a progressive element seeking to change the words of Jesus on marriage and family based upon the gospel narrative. Moses under pressure from the people softened and watered down this issue as well while the chosen Hebrew people slowly marched into the land of milk and honey complaining about this teaching of Yahweh while in the desert. Jesus cleared this up in Matthew 19 and Mark 10. What was supposed to be an 11-day journey, took 40 years due to disobedience. Scripture is not gray on these subjects and all the spin and Google analytics manipulation in the world can’t change the words of Jesus.

    This is the battle of all battles in our midst — marriage and family. Sister Lucia dos Santos of Fatima articulated her prophetic utterance on what we would see for these times and she was correct.

    To end on a hopeful note: If you are looking to turn things around, start with the most basic of all by keeping the Sabbath Holy. Keep Sunday for worship, rest, family meals, and no manual labor if possible; Sunday was not designed by God as a day for running errands.

    Jesus, I Trust in You
     
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  20. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    Wonderful article
    Thank you, Carol, for posting this.
     
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