Papal Heresy?

Agree. 100%

 

Byron, Can you please expand on your 3rd sentence? I don’t understand what you mean. Ty.

 

Hi Garabandal. The author of DD is referring to the Novus Ordo "Act of Contrition" there, not the Sacrament of Penance. We know this because he says that this event occurs at "the beginning of every celebration."

This is just another Modernist goal: to eliminate the idea that individual sacramental confession (when available) is necessary for Catholics to be absolved of mortal sins. Instead, the Modernists have promoted communal confession as an equivalent alternative, which is contrary to Catholic teaching.

 

The original quote came from a press conference in June 2016 (https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/...ancis-in-flight-press-conference-from-armenia)

I think that the intentions of Martin Luther were not mistaken. He was a reformer. Perhaps some methods were not correct. But in that time, if we read the story of the Pastor, a German Lutheran who then converted when he saw reality – he became Catholic – in that time, the Church was not exactly a model to imitate. There was corruption in the Church, there was worldliness, attachment to money, to power...and this he protested. Then he was intelligent and took some steps forward justifying, and because he did this. And today Lutherans and Catholics, Protestants, all of us agree on the doctrine of justification. On this point, which is very important, he [Martin Luther] did not err.​

 

I think the Pope is referring to a joint declaration made in 1999 between the Catholic Church & the Lutherns on the doctrine of justification -

https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/li...eration-on-the-doctrine-of-justification-2290

 

Hi Garabandal. Some might also want to read an assessment of the 1999 Lutheran/Catholic Declaration on Justification by a Lutheran (Paul T. McCain). This article was published in the Catholic journal First Things, but Paul T. McCain is discussing the issue from the perspective of a Lutheran. Very enlightening. Basically, Mr. McCain says that the Lutherans totally surrendered to the Canons of Trent on those issues where there was any agreement. The Catholic Church did not compromise away from Trent:

https://www.firstthings.com/blogs/f...declaration-on-the-doctrine-of-justification/

https://mo.lcms.org/rev-paul-t-mccain-obituary/

 

Padraig, I read through many of the comments and I agree with many of them especially those that state that Jimmy Akin makes this more complicated than it needs to be. What are your thoughts?

I recently posted a video from Return to Tradition which Anthony Stine called New Proof of that the Great Apostasy May Already Be Here. Then I came across that video that I mention above from Desmon Birch which gave me a lot of clarity that we are not there yet. I noticed that RTT has another video about this today. So, I do appreciate this video from Father Mark he confirms what Desmond stated, in so many words. Although, many mystics stated that there will be a time of a Minor Apostasy and I agree that could be where we are. Thank you.

Edited to add the new RTT video since his videos are usually very good.

 

So the Pope is wrong that they are in agreemement over this doctrine.

Martin Luther was clearly wrong on every level a heretic of the worst kind - he will always be a heretic and an irreformable one - a nasty piece of work.

How can anyone Catholic believe there was even one shred of decency in that rogue?

He was not a reformer but a destroyer.

 

I’ve been thinking for awhile about this. We may have seen the same video. I remember that he spoke about lapsed Catholics and heretics not being apostates.

 

Hi Carol,

I am glad I am not the only one that thought that Jimmy Atkins comments were a little too technical for me.

Actually if you look up the definition of the Word in the Catholic Encylopedia I think the word is quite fluid and can have several meanings. I think of it in general sense of someone who no longer believes. Who no longer practices the Faith. Who Deserts the ship.

https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01624b.htm

I think this is what Jesus meant when He said,

Matthew 10:33

But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.

But there is a more formal Apostasy. In Satanism there is a Rite of spitting and stamping on the Cross. This is the reverse of what we do at Easter when we formally renounce Satan and all his works. A good example of this was the Emperor Julian the Apostate , who was a Catholic but on obtaining the Purple renounced the Faith and began to mass murder his fellow Catholics.

I think in Ancient times when they used the word Apostate they meant a Catholic who asked to Sacrifice to the Pagan Gods on pain of Death and did so.

But nowadays I think for the average lay person it is someone who leaves the Faith. At least that is the way I would take it. As simple as that.

Towards the end of time there will be the Great Apostasy, the Great Tribulation and the End of Time. The Last Judgement.

Now we have the Minor Tribulation, the Minor Apostasy.

The Major Tribulation is:

Matthew 24:21

The Abomination of Desolation
…20Pray that your flight will not occur in the winter or on the Sabbath. 21For at that time there will be great tribulation, unmatched from the beginning of the world until now, and never to be seen again. 22If those days had not been cut short, nobody would be saved. But for the sake of the elect, those days will be cut short.…

We are in the End Times it is true. But not the final Chapter of the End Times. For after these days comes the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart and the Great Restoration of the Church and the period of Peace.

After this the Final Apostasy and the coming of the anti Christ. But these days are far ,far away; I believe many centuries.

We are a mirror of what is to come at the End of the World writ small.

Julian the Apostate was so interesting. He was real genius, a kind of little Anti Christ.

 

I was thinking about the other night how would we know that people like the German and Belgian Bishops and Pope Francis were wrong and that we who remain Faithful are right, how would we know this. What would set us apart from each other?

I would say it is the Creed. It is the Creed on which we stand or fall. If the person we are dealing with can recite the Creed and believe it to be true then they are fine.

If however they cannot stand over the Creed, then they are, in my opinion, Apostate. They have left the Faith.

 

Thank you Padraig. I agree.

 

This is exactly what I was referring to. thank you

 

“Do Not Allow Yourselves to Be Deluded.” Our Lady said this to her priests through Fr Gobbi. She was very clear that we ARE living the Great Apostasy. Anyone who says, “this is just a minor apostasy” is wrong. Since Fatima we’ve had constant war, errors taught in school that have separated humanity from God, priests and Bishops who have not opposed false doctrines, and are not in unity with the magisterium, Catholics who no longer follow the Commandments or his Gospel, sin no longer recognized as sin, justifications for homosexuality, abortion, drugs, poverty, violence, destruction of the family, the denial and blaspheme of God, the building of a world without Him, HELLO! The time we are living today is in the Book of Revelations. We have been living through tribulations and chastisements. That’s why Our Lady has been appearing for years all over the world. She’s working overtime to prepare us not just for the Great Chastisement, but to prepare us so we can convert through prayer to finally be lead by her Immaculate Heart to the Second Coming of the glorious reign of her Son, Jesus. “The triumph of my Immaculate Heart will coincide with the triumph of my Son, Jesus, in his glorious reign of holiness and of grace, love and justice, of mercy, and of peace, which will be established in the whole world.” Sounds a lot like the WARNING. “And peace descends from heaven with the song of the angels, the earth opens to receive the dew of Divine Mercy, while the simple hearts of the shepherds open themselves to the voices which announce the wondrous event: ‘Today there is born for you a Savior who is Christ the Lord.’ “Everything is again repeated for his second nativity. His return in glory is just as it was then. As the love of my motherly heart was the most precious crib for his first nativity, so also the triumph of my Immaculate Heart will be the crib at his glorious return.” Our Lady says to begin the period of ADVENT with her. “Surrounded by my immaculate light, which spreads itself everywhere like the dawn to announce the coming of Christ, prepare yourselves all to receive with joy the Lord who is coming. Prepare yourselves well for the holy Nativity.” She tells us we are living the painful times of the chastisement. We are living the most difficult moments of the purification. She tells us peace will only come from conversion by means of prayer, of fasting, and of penance. After the Warning we must do this. Otherwise, at the moment when all will be shouting ‘peace and security’ suddenly calamity will fall. Our Lady in 1987 spoke about the Far East and her Adversary, Satan. She said Satan has come up from the abyss into your midst, to manifest himself as the Red Dragon in all his terrible power. “In fact, he has succeeded in extending his reign in many nations and in spreading his action of denial and of rebellion against God to every part of the earth. The Red Dragon has bound men with the chain of his slavery. He has made you slaves of pride, haughtiness, pleasure, impurity, egoism, and of avarice. He has succeeded in transforming the world into the city of Babylon, perverse and sinful, which, with the cup of pleasure and of luxury, has seduced all the nations of the earth.” Our Lady also said, “but now the the period of this babylonian slavery is about to end.”
This is it folks. We are in the middle of the Great Apostasy. It’s not the end of the world, but the end of an era. Our Lady gave us so much information. She pointed to China and called that nation the Red Dragon of Revelations, where her Adversary is reigning. She gave Asia hope of liberating them from the Red Dragon (communism). She mentioned the apostasy of the interior of the Church. And mentions the man of iniquity entering it. She said Rome would fall under a great Chastisement, and although the United States had wounded Christ, her light will return. I wish most of you would read - “To The Priests Our Lady’s Beloved Sons The Marian Movement of Priests.” It tells it all.

 

Byron, Oh, so Father Gobbi didn’t specifically state that he was told when the Warning would occur. That’s a very important distinction to make imho. Thank you for posting this.

There is a thread on Sr. Jeanne Royer Aug 15, 2013. She wasn’t told when the Warning would occur either but her prophecies are similar to many other approved private revelations and she was given a very good explanation for the end of times. I hope that this is helpful.+

 

Hi Byron. I think a lot of the "apparent" disagreement about certain prophetic events discussed on this forum can be traced to terminology. Everyone has their own favorite source of private revelation. Each person latches onto the terminology used by that particular seer. They don't understand that "apparently" different words used by different seers are referring to the same events in salvation history.

All private revelation, if true, must conform to public revelation approved by the Church. So the sequences of end time events in any private revelation must conform to the sequence in the Biblical prophecies, as the Church understands that sequence. In public revelation, the details are very sparse. Public revelation is like a skeleton. The private revelations just puts meat on the bones of the skeletal public revelation.

Another area causing disagreement is the understanding of what happens AFTER the Warning/Second Coming (which St. Paul and others say is somewhat of a "mystery"). Some prophecies (both private and public) focus more on the REWARD of the just. Other prophecies focus more on the PUNISHMENT of the apostates. The former, the reward, is spoken of as the "period of peace," the "kingdom of God on Earth," the "reign of Mary," the "Millenium," etc. The latter, the punishment, is given names like "the Chastisement," the "Wrath of God," the "Day of the Lord," the "Satanic period." The most important thing to understand is that the Reward/Punishment "period" is a single "period." The reward and punishment are happening SIMULTANEOUSLY. What a particular person experiences is CONDITIONAL, meaning IF you are just, then you experience PEACE, and if you are unjust, then you will experience PUNISHMENT. When people try to fit these "simultaneous" events on a single timeline, it creates the confusion. Events that only happen once in salvation history, get repeated on that false timeline.

We are all on the same team. Team Catholic. Hopefully we can find a way to agree that AFTER the Warning/Second Coming (a supernatural event) there is a lot of mystery that we cannot, as mere mortals, understand.

And as you said, the pre-Warning/Second Coming stuff is less mysterious to those with "eyes to see" because it is happening in front of our face. We are watching the "apostasy" of 2 Thessalonians 2 playing out. We are seeing the sequence laid out in Matthew 24 occurring as stated (I think we are in the "beginning of the sorrows"/ minor tribulation). We are seeing the first few "seals" of the Apocalypse being opened. All of those things, using different terminology, are referring to the exact same eschatological events.

Here is the sequence: "beginning of the sorrows" > minor tribulation > great tribulation > Warning/Second Coming/Miracle > Conditional Reward/Punishment

For those truly living "in a state of grace," or "in conformity with God's will," as the One, Holy, Catholic Church has taught from the beginning, we have nothing to worry about because we will be covered by the mantle of Our Lady. Even if we are persecuted and martyred, we will take it like St. Lawrence and our heavenly reward will be great.

 

Understand exactly what you are saying. And we are getting closer to nuclear war. Gracious, how much more can happen before some wake up?

 

Two things that will hopefully bring a little comfort in all of this:

1. Remember what Jesus said about "wars and rumors of wars" (Matthew 24:6). He said, about that, "See that you be not troubled. For these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet." So whatever happens with any "war," it will not be so bad as to make impossible the things happening in the Church that Jesus describes after that. The Church will still be open and the lights will still be on. People will still have food for their bodies after the "wars." It will not be some total annihilation because "it is the beginning of the sorrows" not "the end."

2. About people not being awake, Jesus talks about this also in Matthew 24. He tells us over and over again to "watch." He tells us not to be obsessed with worldly, material things like people were in "the days of Noah." But we have to accept that just as Noah and his family (a small number) were saved, so only a small number will be in our time as well. It is frustrating, but inevitable.

May God bestow peace and blessings on you and your household.