https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/41164/theologians-accuse-pope-of-heresy Theologians accuse pope of heresy CNA Vatican City, May 1, 2019 / 10:35 am A group of nineteen Catholics, including some prominent academics, have published an open letter to the bishops of the world accusing Pope Francis of heresy. The letter, made public on April 30, was dated "Easter week" and signed by 19 individuals, including Fr. Aiden Nichols OP, an internationally recognized theologian and author. The 15-page letter begins by asking the bishops of the world to take some action against the pope. "We are addressing this letter to you for two reasons: first to accuse Pope Francis of the canonical delict of heresy, and second, to request that you take the steps necessary to deal with the grave situation of a [sic] heretical pope." The letter lists seven specific areas of Church teaching where the signatories believe the pope has "through his words and actions, publicly and pertinaciously" demonstrated his belief in "propositions that contradict divine law." Sent from my iPhone
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/t...-teaching-heresy-suggests-he-may-not-be-pope/ Taylor Marshall accuses Francis of teaching ‘heresy,’ suggests he may not be Pope LifeSiteTue Feb 8, 2022 - 4:04 pm EST (LifeSiteNews) — Taylor Marshall, leading Catholic commentator and author of Infiltration – The Plot to Destroy the Church From Within – has publicly affirmed that Pope Francis taught heresy in his February 2 Wednesday audience and that “a ‘heretical pope’ ipso facto loses the papacy.” His comments come after a recent podcast explaining the Church’s teaching on membership in the Church and Pope Francis’s recent commentson the Church and the Communion of Saints. At Pope Francis’ Wednesday Audience on 2 February, he claimed the “communion of saints” includes those who have “denied the faith” and “denied their baptism.” Let us consider, dear brothers and sisters, that in Christ no one can ever truly separate us from those we love because the bond is an existential bond, a strong bond that is in our very nature; only the manner of being together with each of them changes, but nothing and no one can break this bond. “Father, let us think about those who have denied the faith, who are apostates, who are the persecutors of the Church, who have denied their baptism: Are these also at home?”. Yes, these too, even the blasphemers, everyone. We are brothers. This is the communion of saints. The communion of saints holds together the community of believers on earth and in heaven. A number of Catholics have accused Francis of “heresy,” while others wrote that his address essentially “denies the existence of hell.” The next day, 3 February, Marshall released a 52-minute video entitled Can a heretic be a pope? Pope Francis teaches HERESY: Pope Pius XII condemned the heresy of Francis. In this video he stated that Francis had taught heresy, and gave an explanation of the Church’s traditional teaching on membership of the Church and the Communion of Saints. His video included the words of St Augustine and St Thomas, and focusing on Pope Pius XII’s 1943 encyclical Mystici Corporis Christi, which teaches: [O]nly those are to be included as members of the Church who have been baptized and profess the true faith, and who have not been so unfortunate as to separate themselves from the unity of the Body, or been excluded by legitimate authority for grave faults committed… For not every sin, however grave it may be, is such as of its own nature to sever a man from the Body of the Church, as does schism or heresy or apostasy. In this show he emphasized the idea that heresy, schism and apostasy are means by which someone separates himself from the Catholic Church, as opposed to excommunication – by which someone is removed by authority. This will be the most controversial podcast I’ve ever recorded, but I feel confident in Christ about it and my conscience is clear and ready: https://t.co/GoxirOL0RE — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 3, 2022 A few days later on 7 February, Marshall wrote on Twitter that “A ‘heretical pope’ ipso facto loses the papacy.” Marshall followed this with the question: “Can we say this without blushing?” Eric Sammons, the editor of Crisis Magazine, commented that this idea was not definitive teaching but Marshall responded, “Pius XII taught that Schismatics, heretics and apostates are SEPARATED from the Catholic Church. This is magisterial teaching. A heretic cannot be Pope.” He later affirmed that Christ himself removes a heretical pope from office, and asked whether we are in the Great Apostasy foretold in the New Testament. A “heretical Pope” ipso facto loses the Papacy. https://t.co/8eoMBVQ6tj — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Pius XII taught that Schismatics, heretics and apostates are SEPARATED from the Catholic Church. This is magisterial teaching. A heretic cannot be Pope. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Christ — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Yes this is Catholic 101. A manifest heretic is outside the church. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Are we in the Great Apostasy? — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Wearing a white cassock doesn’t make you Catholic. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 No way. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 When asked whether cardinals and bishops were required to believe this before Pope Francis would be a public heretic, Marshall responded: “Heretical cardinals have lost their office. Heretical bishops have lost their office.” Heretical cardinals have lost their office. Heretical bishops have lost their office. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 He later retweeted Canon 2314 from the 1917 Code of Canon Law, with the comment, “Heretics separate themselves from the Catholic Church.” Heretics separate themselves from the Catholic Church: https://t.co/WPMFYtP0GW — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 As further challenges came in, Marshall insisted that he was not promoting his own ideas, but simply Catholic doctrine, as expressed by both Cardinal John Henry Newman and Pope Pius XII. I didn’t say it. Cardinal Newman said it. Take it up with him. https://t.co/Od8gk5paUc — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 A manifest heretic is OUTSIDE the Church. This is Catholic doctrine. Pope Pius XII says so explicitly. — Dr Taylor Marshall™️ (@TaylorRMarshall) February 8, 2022 Defend pro-life and pro-family journalism today! Now is your chance to join the LifeSiteNews family and defend what your loved ones will cherish forever. Support LifeSiteNews now and take a stand with our cutting-edge pro-life news. Sent from my iPhone
https://thenewamerican.com/faithful...francis-globalism-subversion-heresy-apostasy/ Faithful Catholics Are Resisting Pope Francis’ Globalism, Subversion, Heresy, & Apostasy by William F. Jasper November 4, 2022 AP Images Pope Francis is facing a mounting insurrection within the Catholic prelature, clergy, and laity in response to his ongoing radical efforts to change Catholic doctrine, moral teachings, Church governance, liturgy, diplomacy, and other matters. A prominent cardinal has characterized Pope Francis’ actions as tantamount to “a hostile takeover of the Catholic Church.” An archbishop and former Vatican official has accused the pope of being an “authoritarian tyrant” whose “violent and destructive” actions are causing “incalculable” damage to the Church and the faithful. An internationally renowned Catholic professor at Princeton University called a Pope Francis appointment “shocking and scandalous.” A conference in October of prominent Catholic lay men and women, featuring a bishop and an archbishop, issued a formal declaration of resistance to Pope Francis. And there is much more. Among Pope Francis’ latest scandals are the outrageous and heretical proposals of his Synod on Synodality; his appointment, on October 15, to the Pontifical Academy for Life of Professor Mariana Mazzucato, an atheist, globalist, pro-abortion feminist, and advocate for the World Economic Forum’s Great Reset; his betrayal of China’s persecuted Catholics and the aged, heroic Cardinal Joseph Zen with the Vatican’s agreement with Xi Jinping and the Chinese Communist Party; and his harsh attacks on faithful Catholics and suppression of the traditional Latin Mass, while at the same time refusing to root out homosexual clerics and refusing to condemn or rein in wild liturgical abuses. The pope’s Synod on Synodality, a three-year-long process culminating in October 2024, has already stirred widespread opposition for its calls to embrace same-sex marriage, same-sex adoption, radical “inclusion” of LGBTQ groups, and ordination of women, as well as for the synod’s inclusion of dissident ex-Catholics and anti-Catholics. In an essay for the (U.S.) National Catholic Register, Australia’s Cardinal George Pell wrote, “The synodal process has begun disastrously in Germany, and matters will become worse unless we soon have effective papal corrections on, for instance, Christian sexual morality, women priests, etc.” “We find no precedents in Catholic history for the active participation of ex-Catholics and anti-Catholics in such bodies,” he continued, warning against the synod’s allowing of “serious heresies to continue undisturbed.” Germany’s Gerhard Ludwig Müller, former prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Vatican’s oldest department of the Roman Curia, has been even more pointed in his criticism of the synod, calling it “a hostile takeover of the Church of Jesus Christ.” The synodal leaders, said Cardinal Müller in an October interviewwith Eternal Word Television Network (EWTN), “are dreaming of another church that has nothing to do with the Catholic faith … and they want to abuse this process, for shifting the Catholic Church” and for “the destruction of the Catholic Church.” In a subsequent interview with LifeSiteNews, Cardinal Müller blasted the introduction of same-sex “blessings” by the bishops of Belgium’s Flanders region as “an absolute heresy and schism.” “No bishop or pope has authority to bless something which is against the will of our Creator and our Redeemer,” the Vatican’s former doctrinal chief said. In tandem with the destructive Synod on Synodality, Pope Francis’ manifest subversion of the Pontifical Academy for Life (PAL) over the past several years appears to be a concerted effort to destroy the Catholic Church’s global moral opposition to abortion, euthanasia, and other assaults on the sanctity of life, while simultaneously redirecting the Church’s attention to global warming, ecumenism (including “indigenous” pagan religions), “stakeholder” capitalism, Universal Basic Income, and LGBTQ inclusion. He has taken a sledgehammer to the PAL, founded in 1994 by Pope John Paul II, casting out veteran members who are stalwart defenders of life and replacing them with non-Catholics and anti-Catholics who militantly opposethe Catholic Church’s teachings on life issues. Read the rest at the link
What infuriates me is when they use St. John Henry Cardinal Newman's words (or any other saintly writer) to show they are following "the spirit", like the Canadian Bishops did in 1968. I noticed lately on twitter they trot out, with no context, writings/doings of JPII and Pope Emeritus Benedict to justify what they are doing. I would not trust anything that comes out of the Vatican now that is purportedly from Benedict. Not many noticed, but Cardinal Sarah's resignation from the CDF was accepted exactly one year to the day that the book he co-authored with Benedict was published. Hard to accept that was just a coincidence....
I posted the four articles above just to show that the idea this pope may be a heretic is no longer a private fear kept only to themselves amongst devout Catholics but something that has become very much mainstream. The questions remain, 1) Can a valid pope fall into heresy, given Christ’s promises regarding the papacy? Can a pope be a heretic or does he cease being a pope as soon as he utters heresy? Does that mean a material heretic or a manifest grave persistent heretic? 2) Is it possible a man everyone assumes is pope was not validly elected in the first place, due to error by the resigning pope or activities at the conclave that invalidated his election? Regardless, it is not schismatic or a sin against the papacy to discuss these possibilities.
Agree completely. In fact, I am wondering now about the Bishops over the past decades who were possibly not in communion with the Pope, aka the Vicar of Christ. The current Pope has apparently decided to drop that particular title and prefers Bishop of Rome. This really opens up a lot of questions for me, one of which I'll start a new thread for so not to go sideways here (again )
Yes. A valid Pope can fall into heresy. That’s my own personal opinion. It’s prophecy. Wasn’t Judas an apostle?
Hi Byron. If by "fall into heresy" you mean making a statement that satisfies the conditions related to the Dogma of Papal Infallibility in Pastor Aeternus (Chapter 4, n.9), then it would be impossible for "a valid Pope" to fall into THAT KIND of heresy. If by "fall into heresy" you mean some lower standard of heresy, then you are correct. In that case, the Pope could theoretically "fall into heresy." Or, at least, the Church has not spoken definitively in the matter. For example, when answering questions from a reporter on an airplane or writing something as a private theologian, or giving a speech at an event, a valid Pope could make heretical statements. In all of these examples (and there are many others), he does not satisfy the criteria required in the dogma.
Indeed, truly troubling times. Questioning and raising concerns is definitely fine and on the table. There are legitimate concerns here. I just hope that the questioning here on the forum stays just that - questioning. Where we go from here is rather unclear. There is a real possibility that we don not get clarity until AFTER this papacy. Or maybe the papacy after the next one. Until then we respect his presumed office as pope. Just as Catholics are to respect the presumed sacramental marriage of baptized persons even throughout the annulment process - in fact it would be gravely sinful not to - we should respect the office and authority of this pontiff. God will make clear to us in his own time. We just need to keep the faith until then.
Yes indeed, confusion, confusion, confusion. I note Clare A's comment above too and her reference to confusion. Here's todays meditation in my Divine Mercy in my Soul (St. Faustina) phone App. It sets me wondering about this important thing of Discernment. Perhaps it is a topic for a separate thread. I don't want to divert this thread. I have been wondering if the confusion, my confusion, results from a lack of 'discernment of the spirits' which might be affecting my thinking. What are the tried and tested means of Discernment? I assume that Ignatian discernment of spirits and daily Examen is used by all Jesuits, including Pope Francis. I would think they pride themselves on their judgement and spiritual discernment prowess. Is there something defective in this Ignatian discernment as it is currently practiced? Has it become 'modernised' or corrupted or was it never a method which should have gained a primary role in the development of spiritual lives? Is it practiced to the exclusion of Eucharistic adoration, oral prayer, meditation, contemplation and higher forms or prayer? Or is Ignatian Discernment lacking in those of us who are not with the modernist or even post-modernist agenda in the Church? Archbishop Fulton Sheen said I think that all of his clarity of mind came from being in front of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament. Perhaps what is lacking in Ignatian Discernment, if that is the case, is a focus on Jesus and the Blessed Trinity, and also a focus on the mystical aspect of a relationship with our Blessed Mother Mary. Unfortunately I don't have the answer to these questions but just thought I would put it out there as a topic. #310 The Deviousness of the Evil One The devil is real and his temptations are real. He hates you with a pure hate and desires your destruction. This is good to know. But the evil one is also quite shrewd and manipulative and will rarely speak blatant lies to you since he knows this temptation will most likely not convince you. Instead, he seeks to speak confusion to you, identifying things that are partly true and mixing them with subtle lies so as to lead you astray. You may find that you begin to obsess about this thing or that. And you may find that your reasoning might make some sense, but you begin to experience a sadness and confusion as you think. Stop thinking in those moments and run to the Mercy of God. When your thinking is immersed in God, you are left refreshed and light. You begin to have new joy and clarity. But when the evil one begins to have his way with you, the opposite effects are felt in your soul. Be attentive to his sneaky deceptions and pay no attention to them/ Reflect, today, upon your thinking process. It is here that the tempter works his worst work. Reflect also upon how you feel as you have tried to figure out this situation or another. Commit yourself to a discernment of spirits by especially looking at the effects of your thinking. The Lord invites you to run to His Mercy every time you find yourself confused or misled. Be attentive to these moments and know that they may be the temptations of the evil one. Trust in the Lord always and continually submit your thoughts to His holy Mercy. Prayer Lord, please always protect me from the lies and snares of the evil one. I rebuke him and his works in Your most holy Name and entrust all my thoughts to You. Come pour forth Your Mercy and truth into my life and dispel all darkness and gloom. I love You, dear Lord. Jesus, I trust in You. http://bit.ly/2z2MhOw
You may be on to something here. I rarely read anything from Aleteia anymore because of the entity that runs it, but this came across my surfing the other day. Be careful of Satan when he's sweet and polite, warns pope Francis says we must examine our lives while looking at Christ crucified, to see if the devil has slowly taken over our attitudes The devil is out to seduce us, and he comes into our lives “so sweetly and politely” to take possession of our attitudes, Pope Francis warned. The pope said this today in his morning homily, drawing from today’s Gospel reading about the unclean spirit who goes out of a person but then decides to return, and brings with him seven other spirits “more wicked than itself.” Vatican Radio reported Pope Francis’ emphasis that the passage reflects how demons enter quietly, progressively becoming more and more part of a person’s life. The devil slowly changes our attitudes, camouflaging himself to lead us to what’s called worldliness, Francis explained. This attitude brings us to look at things in ways contrary to the spirit of the Gospel. When the devil enters “so sweetly, politely and takes possession of our attitudes,” the pope said, our values pass from the service of God to worldliness. Thus we become “lukewarm Christians, worldly Christians.” Francis described this as being like a fruit salad — a bit of the spirit of the world and a bit of God’s spirit. Prevention Nevertheless, the Holy Father also said there is a method for preventing this progressive progression of the devil’s seduction: “stopping for a while to examine my life, whether I am a Christian, whether I educate my children, whether my life is Christian or worldly.” The daily examination of conscience is one of the spiritual practices most promoted by the Society of Jesus, the religious order to which the pope belongs. It involves taking a few minutes at the end of the day to look over one’s day — to see the graces that God offered, and to thank him for them, and to see the moments when we refused his grace and chose to act in a way contrary to the Gospel. The examen concludes with a specific resolution to work on the next day. The pope suggested today that this examen can be done while looking at Christ crucified, saying that the crucifix saves us from the charms and seductions that lead us to worldliness. The examination of conscience, the pope said, is done always before Christ crucified, with prayer, after which one has to break loose from one’s comfortable attitudes, through works of charity, visiting the sick, helping someone in need and so on. This breaks up the spiritual worldliness that the band of demons tries to create in us, the pope said. https://aleteia.org/2017/10/13/be-c...5RZ0a0jnSgT-YgUEeyCs7YrpP5Tx58u1eGcFiY9w8hfX0
Great advice, but how does one reconcile this side of Pope Francis with the attitudes represented by the posts of the last few pages of this thread, to take a few examples? It's mental torture trying to make sense, if there is any, of it all.
Padre Pio made this revelation to exorcist Father Gabriele Amorth in 1960: One day Padre Pio said to me very sorrowfully: ‘You know, Gabriele? It is Satan who has been introduced into the bosom of the Church and within a very short time will come to rule a false Church.’” “Oh my God! Some kind of Antichrist! When did he prophesy this to you?” I [Zavala] ask. “It must have been about 1960, since I was already a priest then.” “Was that why John XXIII had such a panic about publishing the Third Secret of Fatima, so that the people wouldn’t think that he was the anti-pope or whatever it was …?” A slight but knowing smile curls the lips of Father Amorth. https://onepeterfive.com/chief-exorcist-father-amorth-padre-pio-knew-the-third-secret/
This is another good example of what happens in upside down world. I didn't explain myself at all. InVeritatem, in his (her?) post stated: "Has it become 'modernised' or corrupted or was it never a method which should have gained a primary role in the development of spiritual lives?" I'm of the mind that that may in fact be part of the many problems we are facing, along with all the "committees".
Mental torture says it all. To quote scripture--at least I think it is scripture: God is not the author of confusion.
Sometimes we have to run away from confusion and find the peace that passes all understanding in the arms of the Lord. “The battle belongs to the Lord.”
