I've heard some talk about 2017 being the beginning of the era of peace and the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary since it's the 100th anniversary of the Fatima apparitions (along with speculation that the 100-year reign of Satan predicted by Pope Leo XIII began in 1917 and therefore ends in 2017.) I am not huge on specific dates myself, but I must say my jaw dropped when I read this article about a 12th century rabbi's incredibly accurate predictions along with this one: "But it gets even more interesting, because Judah Ben Samuel also prophesied that during the 10th Jubilee Jerusalem would be under the control of the Jews and the Messianic “end times” would begin. If he’s right, the 10th Jubilee began in 1967 and will be concluded in 2017. “The Bible should be our standard for prophecy and interpretation of prophetic events,” said Joseph Farah, editor and founder of WND, upon learning of Judah Ben Samuel’s predictions in Israel Today.“But one cannot ignore what this 12th-century rabbi said and wrote. It’s well-documented. And I applaud Israel Today for bringing it to light. The implications of these predictions is staggering to say the least.” Read more: http://www.wnd.com/2012/11/12th-century-rabbi-predicted-israels-future/?cat_orig=faith
I must say I have myself, lately, been leaning towards 2017 because it is the anniversary of Fatima. See what you think. Some more support for 2017 being the year of the miracle (repeated from an earlier thread). The start of Satan's reign of 100 years being in 1917 makes sense also because it was the year of the Russian Revolution when Satan's power showed itself (in a way specifically stated by Our Lady at Fatima) and, if this is so, then obviously he loses his power in 2017. http://aronbengilad.blogspot.co.uk/ (A Catholic Jew Pontificates Blog) Over the years many have speculated when the Warning and the Miracle promised at Garabandal by Our Lady would occur. Today I have been talking with a priest who has known Conchita since 1970 and he is convinced that the Miracle will be on a Holy Thursday (Maundy Thursday). After intense discussion of all the different dates and information united to the Jewish roots we came to the same conclusion that the Miracle would most likely occur on Holy Thursday evening in Spain on 13 April 2017 (which is the eve of 18 Nisan 5777) and that the Warning may occur on Tuesday 18 October 2016. The two dates also both occur in the same Jewish year of 5777. 777 represents the Seal of God and the 5 represents the Hand of God which is the Hand of Miriam (Mary). The Muslims call this hand - the Hand of Fatima. Thus the 18 October 2016 (16 Tishrei 5777)Warning would occur during the Jewish feast of Tabernacles (Sukkot) in 5777 (2016) and the Miracle during the Jewish feast of Passover in 5777 (2017). The hundred years since the apparitions of Fatima began will occur on Saturday 13 May 2017 on which the eve of the Jewish feast of Lag B'omer (Light of the 33rd Day of the counting of Omer) will occur. The one hundred years since the Miracle of the Sun at Fatima will occur on 13 October 2017 (5778) which is Simchat Torah (Rejoicing in the Torah) of 5778 which concludes the Feast of Tabernacles. The Gematria of the word Chai (Life) in Hebrew is 18 and I believe that Jesus the Messiah was resurrected on Nisan 18. Chet=8 and yod =10. 13 represents the 13 aspects of Divine Mercy and is associated with the Book (Meggilah) Esther and Queen Esther (a type of Our Lady) who Jewish tradition calls a Redemptress. In 2017 (5777) the 13 March is on the Feast of Purim. Also that year 2017 (5777) the first day of Jewish Pentecost (Shavuot) is on 31 May a day connected to the apparitions of Our Lady of all Nations. The 9th of Av 5777 is on 1 August 2017 and the 9th of Av 5776 is on 13 August 2016, these may be possible dates for the outbreak of a great war possibly with Russia. The feast day of Our Lady Help of Christians who is the Patroness of Australia and the Conqueror of Islam is on 24th of May. In 2017 (5777) this feast day is on Yom Yerushalayim (Jerusalem Day) celebrating 50 years since Jerusalem became the capital of the New Israeli State.
The 100 years of Satanic power prophesied by Pope Leo XIII in 1883 must end in the victory of the Immaculate Heart of Mary and the promised period of peace, initiated, we assume, by the Warning and/or the Miracle. The only question is: when did that 100 years commence. I have previously said that the Satanic period can be said to have begun with, or during, the first World War (which resulted in the Germans assisting Lenin to reach Russia from exile and so ignite the Revolution) or when the Revolution actually began in the same month as the final Fatima apparition - October 1917 or some date in between. Remember that the Angel of Portugal appeared to the children in the Spring of 1916 and that this could also indicate the beginning of the period. The fact that the Jewish years of Jubilee coincide with our years ending in 17 and 67 would seem to indicate that 2017 is to be the year of the Miracle. If I were a betting man, I would not bet on any date earlier than 2014 and would favour 2017. If the rabbi referred to above is correct, Israel will not lose control of Jerusalem before 2017 and so the current conflict will not end in a full scale war that Israel loses. NOTE - October 13 2017 coincides with the celebration of the major Jewish feast of Simchat Torah. The feast when the Torah rolls are removed from the ark in the synagogues and when, if the miracle occurs, the Jews will also recognise the true Messiah.
Great analogies, SteveD!!! I think it is VERY important that we tie in the Jewish calendars and predictions to Fatima and Madjugorje. I myself had a back-and-forth with a Rabbi for a time who has made some observations like those above. He didn't want to talk much about the Marian sites and messages, but it fueled my fire about everything leading to the same place. Remember, Jesus followed the Torah and the law...so should he/we still? Why not? He made some reforms, but he never said anything about the calendar or the numbers being wrong, so that said... When nothing happened in 2011, some people started pointing to 2016 as the new date for the warning, and then the miracle would be in 2017. Makes sense to me too. So we wait. Again. If it comes and goes also, well then we will look ahead to another time, won't we? God made us this way, he made us to question and to research and to try to discover answers, right? So, though he is probably chuckling at us for our feeble efforts, I hope he isn't offended. We are using the gifts He gave us to try to figure things out, as it is our nature to do. But in the end, God only knows. So why can't people stop speculating, and just "let go and let God"? I don't know, I can't do it either. Personally, I also think the St. Malachy prophecies are real...just my opinion, but they are another indicator for me of where the timeline is right now.
I think we needn't take God literally. 100 years may not mean exactly 100 years but we may give or take some.
This is a link to Roy Schoeman's testimony (a lapsed Jew who had an apparition of Our Lady and is now a devoted Catholic). I am just re-reading his book (Salvation is from the Jews) and would recommend it to anyone who wants to understand the roots of Catholicism properly and the role of Judaism in the future.
Connie, So wonderful to hear from you! Happy Gaudete Sunday! How's the teaching career progressing? Safe in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary!
JUST CAME ACROSS THIS STEVE---You'll love this! (just like I did)---WOW!!! "Yet they cannot be done with Fatima, for the Message of Fatima is from God. Pope after Pope has attested to the supernatural character of the apparitions and the Fatima Message in particular. Even Pope Benedict, who as Cardinal Ratzinger lent his name to the Secretariat of State’s campaign to persuade the faithful that the events predicted in the Third Secret “belong to the past,” 13 has reversed himself and begun to speak of Fatima as a heavenly signpost pointing still to the futurea future in which triumph and tragedy are in the balance. In Bethlehem in 2009, Benedict referred to the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart as an event that has yet to happen: You promised the three children of Fatima that “in the end, My Immaculate Heart will triumph”. May it be so! May love triumph over hatred, solidarity over division, and peace over every form of violence! May the love You bore Your Son teach us to love God with all our heart, strength and soul. May the Almighty show us His mercy, strengthen us with His power, and fill us with every good thing. (Cf. Lk 1:46-56) On May 13, 2010 at Fatima, the Pope prayed that the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary be realized before 2017 A.D. Thus, Pope Benedict XVI himself rejects the absurd contention of human “authority” (such as Cardinal Bertone) that the 1984 ceremony was the “Consecration of 12 “Introduction”, The Message of Fatima (2000), www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/ documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20000626_message-fatima_en.html. 13 Ibid., “Theological Commentary”. http://www.fatima.org/news/newsviews/newsviews090910.pdf 6Russia” 14 Our Lady has requested and that what we see in Russia todaya neo-Stalinist dictatorship and three abortions for every womanand that what we see in the world todaymoral, spiritual, social, political and economic collapseis the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart that She promised upon Russia’s consecration to Her. That the Message of Fatima is from God is the reason that, as one Catholic writer so aptly put it, Fatima keeps bobbing to the surface like a cork underwater. What certain men, who exceed their authority, keep trying to submerge—Fatima—rises again and again, with the Pope himself frustrating their effort to keep it down. "
Thanks, I certainly do love it. I did not know that the Pope had referred to 2017, all very interesting.
I have the warning coming in at 2016/2017 given Fatima 100th anniversary/the age of Joey Lomangino & the fact that the Illumination comes when things are at their worst - in terms of persecution of the Church and bloody revolution on the streets - we are getting there quicker each day - the next three years are going to be decisive years -- so conversion is of utmost importance in this time of grace for when the tribulation really gets going then it will be very difficult to change & convert because so much of normal life will be disrupted -- I hope we all realise God has not abandoned us but has been 'testing our metal in recent years' to try our faith, increase our trust and reliance on Divine Providence for when we have trust in our Father in Heaven --- we have everything we need for the days ahead.
This is a fascinating thread...so many good points made. Steve D...I feel in my bones that you may be right about the timing.Something that stuck out in my mind was the 18th. My mental faculties grow dim but I recall a prophecy concernig the 18th but I can't connect the dots. Also garabandal...do you have a medal containing a parchment of paper from one of the seer's at Garabandal. Joey use to offer them on his website...the promise that we would do part of our purgatory on earth...if so...I wear mine daily and life is a purgatory. I attest it works.
I have a Garabandal Medal. I sewed it onto my brown scapular along with a Fatima Medal with soil from the Fatima site. After doing this in 2000 I was immediately diagnosed with Rhuematoid Arthritis so it worked for me too!
Carmel333...thats great...not that you got RA...but that you wear it every day. If I recall correctly... the parchment of paper comes from a text that Mary our Mother kissed herself. We are blessed to wear such a sacred relic. I can honestly attest that since wearing that medal along with the scapular of benediction and protection... I have been purified by fire. It has turned the bow of my boat back to God as I used to be an enemy of God. Garabandal...I don't know if you can find the medals but it is a great gift our Lady gives us. I will ask my guardian to help find your medals as well as St Anthony.
I have two of the parchment relics from Garabandal. I was using one for protection and it sits on the mantle at home and I received a second, which I requested with the intention of wearing. BUT, I am afraid to wear the relic as I am concerned what my purgatory on earth will entail. I have six children, ages 11 and younger, and am afraid that my suffering will also involve them. If it was just me I would wear it in a heartbeat. It sits now by the other relic and I ponder whether I should put it on. But as Timothius stated, how blessed to possess a parchment kissed by the mother of God! I continue to pray and ponder on what to do.
The hardest thing for anyone human is to let Jesus take over our fears. JPII's motto, "Be not Afraid". Sister Faustina said it best: "When I look into the future, I am frightened, but why plunge into the future? Only the present moment is precious to me, as the future may never enter my soul at all". " O great and Divine Sacrament that veils my God! Jesus, be with me each moment, and no fear will enter my heart". As for purgatory, we have an opportunity to make plenary indulgences throughout the whole Year of Faith by praying at the Church of our baptism and fullfilling the other normal conditions of confession, rosary and Eucharist. We also have Mercy Sunday coming and Jesus said, on Mercy Sunday..."whoever approaches the Fount of Life on this day will be granted complete remission of sins and punishment". What a awesome God we have, full of Mercy and Kindness, which we have no claim to!!!
You should pose this idea to Glenn. It seems to contradict an earlier limitation that the Miracle would not be on a feast of Our Lord or Our Lady. That would throw all speculation about Holy Thursday out the window. Maybe Glenn can comment on whether that is a true statement made by Our Lady to the girls or not (about the martyr feast day).
cornhusker, You have no reason whatsoever to expect that by not wearing/carrying with devotion the little parchment blessed by Our Heavenly Mother you will suffer LESS or not suffer a "purgatory" on earth. What we have been promised is that we will make up during our lifetime on earth for the real Purgatory after death, that is a direct ticket to Heaven at death. I would say that there is a key aspect that you make apparent in your post: we need to be ready and willing to accept whatever comes from God -no matter what- with a purity of intention, a purity of surrender and a love that would make our life very pleasing to God and truly purifying for all our sins and failings of a lifetime. This is what we were born for in the first place: first class holiness, nothing less. Our Blessed Mother promises a special help with it through the token of her kiss become physical. We don't get there in one step but the constancy in practicing this faith and desire, with the help of Our Mother, will make it come to pass. This is A HUGE PROMISE. And we have nothing to lose. I will tell you that I do carry this blessed little parchment with me constantly, and think "call on it" so to speak when I face difficult circumstances for protection -for myself or others. I think it is all about FAITH, not magic. I would suggest that you PRAY FOR THE GRACE to accept from God whatever the future might bring for you and your loved ones, entrusting yourself to our Blessed Mother for protection. You may want to take a look at the Consecration to Jesus Through Mary of St. Grignon de Momfort. I'm sure if you pray for it, you will receive the grace of courage and discernment. The most repeated expression in the Bible is DON'T BE AFRAID!!!! It was told even to our Blessed Mother, Virgin Most Pure, Immaculate Conception. So you are in good company feeling some scare at the power of the sacred in your life. Jesus, I trust in You! Praying for you and with you.
Another Jewish source prophesying 2017 as being a pivotal year in history. "Judah Ben Samuel was a legendary and prolific German rabbi of the 12th century who made some astonishing and specific predictions about the future of Jerusalem and Israel that came true. Judah Ben Samuel, also known as Judah he-Hasid (Judah the Pious), lived and worked from the end of the 12th century until the beginning of the 13th century in Regensburg, authoring a number of books in the German language. Ludwig Schneider of Israel Today magazine has translated some of his work into English over the last few years, including “The Book of the Pious – Sefer Hasidim” and the “Book of Calculations – Sefer Gematriyot.” Following the Christian crusades to the Holy Land, between 1096 and 1270, a regular correspondence developed between the Jews in the Holy Land and the Christian West. Thus, for example, the rabbis in Worms and Regensburg in Germany knew that Saladin’s Ayyubids had been ruling in the Holy Land since 1187. At this time, Judah Ben Samuel published the results of his biblical calculations (Gematria) and astrological observations and summarized as follows: “When the Ottomans (Turks) – who were already a power to be reckoned with on the Bosporus in the time of Judah Ben Samuel – conquer Jerusalem they will rule over Jerusalem for eight jubilees. Afterwards Jerusalem will become no-man’s land for one jubilee, and then in the ninth jubilee it will once again come back into the possession of the Jewish nation – which would signify the beginning of the Messianic end time.” One jubilee is 50 years (Leviticus 25). It is the 50th year after seven times seven years, the year in which each person should regain ownership of his or her land. Ben Samuel’s calculations were purely theoretical; there was absolutely no sign at that time of their being fulfilled. He himself was not able to experience their fulfilment, for it was only 300 years after his death that the first of his predictions were to come true. The Mamluks, who had been reigning in Jerusalem since 1250, were conquered in 1517 by the Ottoman Turks. They remained for eight jubilees (8 x 50 = 400 years), that is to say they were in Jerusalem for 400 years. Exactly 400 years later, in 1917, the Ottoman Turks were conquered by the British. The League of Nations conferred the Mandate for the Holy Land and Jerusalem to the British. Thus, from 1917, under international law, Jerusalem was no-man’s land. Then, when Israel captured Jerusalem in the Six Day War of 1967, exactly one jubilee (50 years) after 1917, Jerusalem reverted to Jewish-Israeli ownership once again. Thereby, according to the prophecies of Judah Ben Samuel, the Messianic End Times began. Many scholars have studied and made reference to Judah Ben Samuel’s writings in an effort to understand how he reached his conclusions. Among those referencing Ben Samuel were Rabbi Isaac Ben Solomon Luria, a mystic dealing with the messianic world (Jerusalem, 1531-1572, Safed); Joseph Solomon Delmegido (1591 Candia – 1655 Prague), a mathematician and astronomer (“Mazref le-Chochma”), Azulai I (1724-1806), a famed bibliographer; Samuel David Luzzatto (1800-1865), a Bible scholar; historian Heinrich Graetz (1817-1891); and Torah scholar Jacob Epstein (1925-1993). The secret of how Judah the Pious arrived at such accurate predictions has less to do with the actual calculations than it does with the fact that he had consecrated his life to God. His pupils Rabbi Isaac ben Moses (Vienna), Rabbi Baruch ben Samuel (Mainz) and Rabbi Simcha (Speyer) testify that Ben Samuel was a model of abstinence and selflessness and was awaiting with a burning desire the coming of the Messiah. Ben Samuel was often called “Light of Israel.” Even bishops came to him for advice. If anyone asked him where his wisdom came from he would answer, “The prophet Elijah, who will precede the Messiah, appeared to me and revealed many things to me and emphasized that the precondition for answered prayer is that it is fuelled by enthusiasm and joy for the greatness and holiness of God.” But to recap the astonishing predictions: In AD 1217 this scholarly and pious rabbi prophesied that the Ottoman Turks would rule over the holy city of Jerusalem for eight Jubilees. Now, keep in mind, he made this prediction 300 years before the Ottoman Turks seized control of Jerusalem in 1517. If indeed 1217 and 1517 were jubilee years as Judah Ben Samuel believed, then his prophecy was exactly right, because exactly 400 years after the Turks took control of Jerusalem they were driven out of the city and the holy land in 1917 by the Allied forces under the command of General George Allenby – on Hanukkah, by the way. But it gets more interesting still. The rabbi also prophesied that during the ninth Jubilee Jerusalem would be a “no-man’s land.” This is exactly what happened from 1917 to 1967, due to the fact that the Holy Land was placed under British Mandate in 1917 by the League of Nations and literally “belonged” to no nation. Even after Israel’s war of independence in 1948-49, Jerusalem was still divided by a strip of land running right through the heart of the city, with Jordan controlling the eastern part of the city and Israel controlling the western part of the city. That strip of land was considered and even called “no-man’s land” by both the Israelis and the Jordanians. It was not until the Six Day War in 1967 when the entire West Bank of the Holy Land was conquered by the Israeli army that the whole city of Jerusalem passed back into the possession of Israel. So once again the prophecy made by the rabbi 750 years previously was fulfilled to the letter. It certainly would be significant if both 1917 and 1967 were Jubilee years, considering the significance of what happened in Jerusalem on those years. But it gets even more interesting, because Judah Ben Samuel also prophesied that during the 10th Jubilee Jerusalem would be under the control of the Jews and the Messianic “end times” would begin. If he’s right, the 10th Jubilee began in 1967 and will be concluded in 2017. “The Bible should be our standard for prophecy and interpretation of prophetic events,” said Joseph Farah, editor and founder of WND, upon learning of Judah Ben Samuel’s predictions in Israel Today.“But one cannot ignore what this 12th-century rabbi said and wrote. It’s well-documented. And I applaud Israel Today for bringing it to light. The implications of these predictions are staggering to say the least.”
OK. These are all significant, and probably true. But the big question is "What do they have to do with the Miracle?" We need to get the possible timelines out on the table, and if it isn't clear, we should ask Glenn if he can shed any light. Maybe he can't add to it, but maybe Conchita has said as much, and some of her previous statements can help in discerning. What I mean is this: The Miracle, as described, is associated with the Warning. Both are within 12 months of each other. Both together represent a great act of God's Mercy through Christ. However, both precede an unknown period of time, and said period of time precedes the Chastisement. And with Fatima in mind, can we assume this: The Triumph of the Immaculate Heart represents the completion of the victory over Satan and evil. The Triumph of the Immaculate Heart immediately precedes the era of peace (which varies in eschatological opinions among people). Therefore, the Chastisement must precede the Triumph. Therefore, the established order of events could be argued as this: Warning -> Miracle -> (time) -> Chastisement -> Triumph -> Era of Peace Tribulation -> Tribulation -> Tribulation -> Judgement & Return (<-arguably) If the Triumph was prophecied in 1917, and then the completion of the Triumph was mentioned by Pope Benedict XVI on May 13, 2010 (as in "These seven years from MAy 13, 2010 to May 13 2017 shall hasten the fulfillment of the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart), then why would anyone place the date of the Miracle in 2017? In addition, the theories placing the Miracle in 2017 also claim the Miracle will be on Holy Thursday, which I believe violates a condition given by Conchita that it would not be a feast of Our Lord (Glenn please verify). We know the amount of time between the Warning and Miracle is between 8 days and 365 days. We don't know the time between the Miracle and the Chastisement. But I think it is reasonable to say it is not days or weeks (probably at least months). Since tribulation time lasts around 3 years, and conceivably has recently begun or will begin very soon, we should expect the Warning in the early or middle part of the tribulation time, and the Miracle within 12 months of that. Placing the Triumph in 2017, not the Miracle. Any thoughts on my theories above? These things have been running around in my mind for 6 months...
