Should Amercian Catholics Still be Patriotic?

Discussion in 'Positive Critique' started by padraig, Jul 4, 2023.

  1. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    Happy Independence Day.:)

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  2. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I came across the above video by accident and it forced me to ask the question if I still loved my own Native Country, Ireland.

    Well I was certainly brought up to be Patriotic. As a young man I fought for her and was very ready to die for her which I nearly did many times.

    But now?

    Ireland has changed totally since I was young. I would certainly no longer describe her really as Catholic or Christian. So to be honest I no longer love her. Not really. I would certainly no longer be prepared to die for her or fight for her.I'm not really ashamed to say that; it's just the way it is.

    I would however be prepared to die for her, to see her converted to the One True Faith again.

    But to be honest I am really ashamed of Ireland and to call myself Irish. That's just the way it is. Her being Catholic was the heart of what she was and all that I loved. When she lost her heart she lost my love. In fact far from loving her , she fills me with feelings of revulsion.

    But I suppose everyone has to make their own minds up.

    America is maybe a little different , there are still many millions of good people fighting for the Truth and Liberty. You are still fighting for the Soul of a Nation, I am afraid here in Ireland we have already lost. Ireland is I am afraid Spiritually dead and pagan. Be sure America does not wind up in the same sad,sorry state.

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    Last edited: Jul 4, 2023
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  3. xsantiagox

    xsantiagox Archangels

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    Chesterton has said about Kipling “He loves England because she is strong, not because she is English.”
    in all cases I think one should love his home-town and general culture and the like, while disdaining foreign policies, politicians etc, as source of pride . I have seen much more argentina flags in a shanty down than in a residential tower block(y)
     
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  4. Adoremus

    Adoremus Powers

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    I feel exactly the same.
     
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  5. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I would say I love God because well ,He is God. That is reason enough.

    I would say I love my family because they are well worth loving, they are loveable. But my country or my home city? I have fallen entirely out of love for my country. I don't think you can force love. It is no good saying I love something out of duty. Love cannot be forced. You either love or you don't. I am afraid my fierce love just up and died.

    As to my home city. Well it has changed beyond recognition. I sometimes walk through the Cathedral District which now home to the Sodomites. I walk through it and I might as well be an Alien from another Planet. I am stranger in my own town. So, no I can't really say I love my home town either to be honest.

    I think in either case to be a Catholic is to be a Pilgrim. To be someone passing through. Our Forefathers in the Faith must have fell very like this in Ancient Pagan Rome.

    Just passing through. I don't really love much about any of it. And the little I do love fades rapidly more and more away with each passing day.

    Like a fading ghost in the night, like a sighing wind.
    The Ireland I loved is gone and my fierce love has walked out the door of passing time hand in hand right along with it. It is hard to love what is not worth loving.

     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2023
  6. Katfalls

    Katfalls Powers

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    I couldn’t even get through the video because this man is confusing patriotism with Freedom! That’s what our patriots fought for. That’s what makes this Republic unique. Yes we have our problems but we shall overcome as long as we have our Bill of Rights and Constitution. Patriots will step up to ensure our Freedom. We are a diverse ethnic experiment and with God as our focus we can accomplish lofty goals. Read the lyrics to our national anthem, to America the beautiful, to the Battle Hymn of the Republic (Abraham Lincoln’s favorite song). We still have our guns, we can protest, we can pray, we have school choice, states rights. I am blessed to be a citizen of the USA. But not without great cost and sacrifice of my Irish and English ancestors. I had an ancestor born on the Mayflower, Puritans escaping the wrath of English monarchs persecuting them. I am a member of the Daughters of the American Revolution with my ancestral ancestors in the Revolutionary war including: Rev Col John Young, Daniel Buck Sgt Massachusetts, Deacon John Hanks Connecticut Line Minute Man, Elijah Hanks Connecticut Line, Uriah Hanks made gun locks, Col Benjamin Hanks drummer, Zachariah Sutton battles of Hackensack, Wilmington, Chemung, Pvt Moses York, First Regiment NY.
    I’m related to Abraham Lincoln through the Hanks. My Irish ancestors are from Kerry, no strangers to strife. I salute them, they were not afraid. And we still have the Motto: In God We Trust. They were patriots and because of them we have Freedom! Its not easy to maintain but the immigrants coming over here really like this freedom. God save us. I tear up thinking of their sacrifice. 7F2592B3-812E-427D-A49D-6BBE86168BD3.jpeg
     
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  7. AED

    AED Powers

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    So many of your thoughts and emotions are mine as well. I deeply love what my country stood for--for the good that was in us but we have been selfish and sloppy and very naive. This once great country is almost unrecognizable in so many ways. My state just passed a ghastly abortion bill. God help us. Its one thing to have these horrors forced on us but to choose them. To agree with them. That is what devastates me. I too am a stranger in a strange land. I must remember I have here no lasting city. I remember so vividly the safe world of my childhood. My beautiful country.. The wholesome goodness of it. It breaks my heart to think on it.
     
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  8. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    What an impressive lineage!
     
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  9. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    Ditto.
     
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  10. Katfalls

    Katfalls Powers

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    It’s a lot to live up to! I hope I don’t disappoint them. Keep the Faith!
     
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  11. Carmel333

    Carmel333 Powers

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    As I was going to sleep last night with the booms of the fireworks waking me back up, these words very loudly came into my heart and I'm not sure where they came from: "One Nation under God, Indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for all."

    This of course is from our pledge of allegiance but it seems to me the Lord was reminding me of this for some reason Although none of the above seems true anymore here in the USA! I love what my country was founded on, the hope and hard work of my ancestors, people who gave every extra cent and hour they had to build gorgeous Cathedrals to God that I am still able to worship in, and of course proudly gave their lives if needed. These people are STILL in my country, its just that the selfish sinful groups are so flamboyant and loud it seems they have taken over. But I'm not so sure.....
     
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  12. AED

    AED Powers

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    Beautiful and stirring Katfalls. Impressive. I too have such people in my family line also on my mother's side. And yes, huge sacrifices. On my father's side it is less documented but the family lore indicates fighting in the Revolution. I know my Irish ancestors went through struggles and hardships to get here. You mention being related to Abraham Lincoln through the Hanks. I always remember a poem my mother used to read to me about Nancy Hanks who was I believe Lincoln's mother.
     
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  13. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    Yes, she was his mother.
     
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  14. jackzokay

    jackzokay Powers

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    You've posted some good stuff in your time Padraig, but that assessment of Ireland has to be among the most accurate.

    Ironically, during my student days I spent a few summers in America, working. And as nostalgic young people sometimes do, I ended up with a tattoo on my shoulder.
    Of Ireland.
    It never really bothered me. But as I grew older, and witnessed Irelands demise, it played / and plays on my mind. I want it removed now - or done over with something else. But at my age Im sure I'll never really follow through on that. Still, I'd like to...

    As I watched the introduction and embracing of abortion and the destruction of marriage and as I see the empty pews, I regret more and more that tattoo. Pride flags. The mocking of the church. The outright contempt they have for my Jesus. All of it makes me detest my own country.
    It is still a very, very stunning and beautiful place. The scenery, the rolling hills, the stunning views... Ireland still looks the same. And on certain days, in certain places (usually the isolation of Donegal for me) it still feels the same. But there is a great difference now generally.
    The cities, the people. Certainly the conversation.
    The absence of God is apparent.
    What is sweeping in, that which will fill the void of His presence; the Irish won't like one bit. But as a people; THEY (the majority of our people) chose it.
    And that which is coming, terrifies me.

    John Waters often speaks of what happened to Ireland. I could listen to him all day.

     
  15. Sam

    Sam Powers

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    Jack, just use that tattoo to remind you to pray for your country. A simple - Eternal Father, have mercy on us and bless Ireland. Mother Angelica said if her establishment of the whole EWTN network saved one soul, it would be well worth it. If you save even one soul with your prayer it will be well worth it.
     
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  16. Katfalls

    Katfalls Powers

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    My Irish Dad would say Don’t Give Up The Ship. In my family we are proud to be Irish. Ireland is going through great struggles right now but at least you know who your enemies are and they are not hiding any more. I’d rather meet them head on. Just think, Bishop Sheen was Irish! Throughout history Ireland has produced many Greats and I’m sure she will not go down without a fight. It took many years for the USA to overturn Roe v Wade. Lots of prayers, they are powerful. What the world needs now is more Irish. Keep the Faith.
     
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  17. Scolaire Bocht

    Scolaire Bocht Archangels

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    I agree with Katfalls, this is no time to lose heart. You know in Ireland in the last few months there is a little stirring of rebellion, not much as yet but a little.

    Stopping the hate speech bill was amazing, we are a supposed democracy but I actually cannot remember any time before when the public had any real say on Irish laws. So its something.

    But certainly what you said about the faith is 100 per cent the truth, the fighting fire of this race comes through that, without it we are a very conformist lot. But even there, the Latin mass communities for example, seem to be growing.

    So yes its difficult but don't give up on the nation yet, some of us are still fighting!
     
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  18. Mario

    Mario Powers

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    Family, truth, beauty...Tucker hits home runs in this clip.

     
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