does devotion to a false religion make God more upset?

Discussion in 'Questions and Answers' started by xsantiagox, Jul 12, 2023.

  1. xsantiagox

    xsantiagox Archangels

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    in an old simpsons episode, Homer is looking for excuses to avoid going to church and he jokingly says " what if we are in the wrong religion, and every time we pray, we're making God angrier and angrier"?
    I think this can be an actual very deep theological question. for example, muslims must pray 5 times a day- but allah is a false god (he isnt the trinitarian christian God). would this mean the true God prefers a muslim follow natural law but is lazy at praying, over a muslim who dutifully prays the 5 times? or is religious faith in itself rewarded? If it is, what about far more "stranger" gods like Shiva, or palo monte deities? were is the line drawn between being a religious member of a false religion, and being an active idol worshipper?
     
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  2. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    “I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life”
    said Jesus.
    “He who has seen Me has seen the Father”
    “Thou art Peter and upon this Rock I will establish My Church.”
     
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  3. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I saw an old Muslim sweeping one time and in his hand was his little prayer beads. I could see that as he worked by the movement of his lips he was praying. I was so touched by this as it reminded me of my grandmother who seemed to have the beads glued permanently to her hand.

    When I was in Instanbul on the train at rush hour I noticed quite a few men using their prayer beads. Once again very touching. Although, strange it seemed to be the men rather than the women.

    In the Military grave yard the poor people were so good at visiting their poor young soldier dead, so very many of them. Although they have no concept of Purgatory the natural urgings of their hearts seemed to summon them to prayer at the graveyard.

    The call of Faithful to prayers several times a day reminded me so much of our Angelus.

    Poor people, I think so many of them live hard lives. They love their family and country as we do. As to God I am happy enough to leave things in His ever merciful hands to sort out.. May He be ever merciful to them.
     
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  4. maryrose

    maryrose Powers

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    God's ways are not our ways and God's thinking is not our thinking. We are all God's creation and He loves each person. A Muslim who sincerely believes in Allah and who follows his concience and prays is not judged negatively. I believe he is praying to God, even though he does not have a concept of the Trinity.
    Peace on earth to men of good will.
    I pray that they will all come to recognise Jesus who has redeemed everyone if not in this world then in purgatory
     
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  5. Carmel333

    Carmel333 Powers

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    I believe that the difference is rejection of the true God. He showed up on earth and told us the Truth. He full-filled centuries of prophecy, did numerous public miracles, and died Himself, then raised Himself from the dead. His witnesses all died to testify to this. If you know that this happened and still cling to a false religion made up by man, I would think you are in trouble with God. If you were raised on a remote island, never heard the Gospel through no fault of your own, and loved your creator in the wrong religion, that is a different matter. I think ALL of us have to come to this....even me who was raised Catholic. "Who do YOU say that I Am??" Protestants also would be guilty of rejecting Jesus obviously because they reject His Church and the Authority it has over them. They reject the Sacraments He gave us and said we needed for Salvation, so even though they say they are worshipping the correct God, they too are subject to judgement on disobedience to Jesus commands.
     
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  6. Carmel333

    Carmel333 Powers

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    Of course God loves everyone! but He Himself says there are certain requirements for salvation. Do these people even care? Are they even interested in the Trinity or what God revealed about Himself? Or are they only interested in their own customs, opinions, and thoughts of who they think God is rather than seeking the Truth (which in this day and age especially is amazingly available to anyone who is interested) How can you truly love someone you don't know? And knowing that God gave us insights and truths about Himself how can one just not be interested in knowing those truths? If you married and your spouse tried to tell you about themselves, and you just said: "whatever! I'm not really interested. Just fulfill your duties and love me...." they would not feel very loved or cherished by you. If you are not interested in God enough to find out what He revealed to us, I don't think you can claim to really love or worship Him no matter how many religious acts you do...
     
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  7. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

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    The Catechism:
    Who made me? God made you.
    Why did God make me?
    To know Him, love Him, and serve Him in this life, and be happy with Him in the next.
     
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  8. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I know that as the Church as always taught that,

    Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus

    Outside the Church there is no Salvation and this is of course the Truth, the Teachings of the Church:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/zc668mn/revision/3


    The Catholic Church traditionally taught that only those who were believers and members of the Catholic Church could be saved. There was no salvation for those outside of the Church.

    The Council of Florence, 1441, stated that The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church... can have a share in life eternal...

    Pope Pius IX in his encyclical letter (1863) said that Well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. This refers to the belief that only those who are in full communion with the Catholic Church and accept the teachings and magisterium of the Church can be saved.
     
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  9. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    'However, Pope Pius goes on to state that even people who are ignorant to the faith can achieve eternal life, as long as they live moral lives and follow the natural law as set out by God. God will not condemn those who have not committed a deliberate sin.

    This statement by Pope Pius was further explained by the Second Vatican Council. It was made clear that although salvation can only come through Christ Jesus and the Catholic Church (of which Jesus is the Head), people outside of the Church can also achieve salvation. This does not mean that the Church should stop all its work though. It means that the Church’s mission to educate others about Christ is more important.'
     
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  10. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I live on my own and do not meet many people. The very few I do happen to meet tend to be Catholics in a Church setting. Devout Catholics, going to Mass every day. I certainly never meet non Christians and rarely even Protestants.

    However when I was in Instanbul I met a young Syrian girl who was a refugee from the war there, a Muslim who was working as a Medical Aide in the clinic I was attending.

    I noticed her staring in what looked like horror at the gold Large, St Benedict's Cross I wore over my tee shirt. :D Muslims tend to look at us Christians as Infidels ,doomed to hell. Drek

    Nevertheless for some odd reason we got on like a house on fire and she really liked me very much. I know this because I heard her arguing like crazy with the Turkish Doctors when they took her off my case. She wanted to keep with me.

    Anyway I became very fond of her too.

    I accept the simple mechanics of the Council of Florence that outside the Church there is no Salvation. That's fine.

    But and its a big but the Holy Spirit is a trickster. He dances and jumps about and does exactly what He pleases. He dislikes being put in anyone's boxes.

    We can't pin Him down to much.

    I have seen it in my own life were people have had a very,very poor opinion of me. They have put me in a box as no good. That girl from Syria, certainly she was a Muslim. A young girl who has known considerable suffering in her short life. If the Holy Spirit could sort me out I like to hope He could sort anyone else out.

    I have hope.
    She had a bad opinion of me at the start because I wore a big gold Cross. I never had a bad opinion of her and that never changed. Life is full of surprises and the Holy Spirit has a lot to do with that.

    He dances, He grins.
     
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  11. Mario

    Mario Powers

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    I like to return to Paul and check in on myself (so to speak):

    Philippians 1: 6 And I am sure that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ. 7 It is right for me to feel thus about you all, because I hold you in my heart, for you are all partakers with me of grace, both in my imprisonment and in the defense and confirmation of the gospel. 8 For God is my witness, how I yearn for you all with the affection of Christ Jesus. 9 And it is my prayer that your love may abound more and more, with knowledge and all discernment, 10 so that you may approve what is excellent, and may be pure and blameless for the day of Christ, 11 filled with the fruits of righteousness which come through Jesus Christ, to the glory and praise of God.

    Because Christ is the sole Mediator, I need to better witness in some small way when I am out and about. If I'm afraid to speak up, then may my actions speak louder than words. I am responsible not to live the life of a hypocrite. The answer is LOVE, for Christ and for souls that may be lost. May both words and actions bear witness.
     
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  12. Luan Ribeiro

    Luan Ribeiro Powers

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    I think there is a principle of rationality that makes belief in polytheism inexcusable, which is the fact that a god so powerful as to create the cosmos cannot be dethroned by lesser spiritual creatures as in Greek mythology, and likewise, the creator of the cosmos cannot be reduced to a co-ruler of the universe with other gods of different essences. In the case of Muslims who are monotheists, it seems plausible to me that they will be judged according to the light they had on Christ and the gospel.
     
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