The locutions of LTTW (locutions to the world) feature heavily in this forum. I have noticed a number of posts which have quite forthrightly stated they no longer feel that the locutions are authentic. A poll to see how many still have confidence in the locutions. And I would be grateful for a response to this question: I have not read any post which outright condemns LTTW. If this is so, what are the dangers, if any, of following a locution which is not authentic.
Apparently the one thing that keeps them going is that they have not swayed from church doctrine. But that might be a lure to 'bait the fish' until the fish is hooked on an error and then can't shake loose. I am very cautious about them, yet I have not given up completely as they seem to have some merit. If/when something profound is predicted with accuracy that seems to validate the messages I will give it more serious consideration, but until then I will not go out of my way to look them up. Even the Fatima messages were authenticated through the request of the villagers to our lady and she consented.
I asked in prayer, and the feeling I got was that this is an authentic messenger, but she lets her own ideas and thoughts mix in. This seems very dangerous to me, especially in a time of great deception. We need to pray for that her spiritual director will be led by the holy spirit in approving these messages.
I think the great danger with the false is that just as nature abhors a vacuum so demonic forces will not long leave empty the places inside of the deluded. I think we see this most readily in those who abuse heavy drugs. The, 'Bad trips', people have are often I suspect devils entering thorugh doorways that should have remained shut. Whilst it is easy enough to spot people who are unwell or deluded once demons appear on the scene it is much easier to be hoodwinked. LTTW is not demonic but simple, very imaginative delusion. But like a saucer of milk the will evntually I suspect turn very sour indeed. At the root of all such illusion is pride the need to be considered, 'special'... and this is the doorway through which the demons will find entry.
I am still discerning. I was praying about them this morning in the car and what came to my heart was our Lady saying at Medjugorje, "If I have to appear to every single person in the world in their living room, I will." (paraphrased mind you.) Then I remembered our Lord saying to me one time in adoration when I was whining about my husband not being like me, and why couldn't he be AS devout, AS in openly in love with Jesus, AS enthusiastic etc... and Jesus very forcefully said--VERY clearly..."Could you handle it?!?" That STOPPED me right in my thought process...whoa. AND HE WAS RIGHT! I would not get to travel to the wonderful conferences, Europe, retreats or get to do the things Jesus has me do! He has my husband right where he wants him--on his own journey! I just needed to suck it up and APPRECIATE HIM! But to have Jesus speak to me in that tone, was startling. Jesus and Mary speak differently to everyone. I'm sorry, as I discern I am reminded how desperate they are for the salvation of souls. I have not seen doctrinal error. I still am blown away at the differences between Vassula and this messenger from Pennsylvania regarding Russia. I DO however have a different perspective in that I have had visions about the situation in Ukraine vs Russia, I do have friends there, and I do have friends who are on both sides! I DO SEE HOW GOD CAN USE PUTIN FOR THE GREATER GOOD! Believe it or not. Chastisement is Chastisement---whoever God uses. It will be interesting to see how these messages unfold. I do know that the good Msgr. John Esseff, who I have spoken to twice now, is going out on a limb publishing these messages AND he is well educated enough to know when there is a doctrinal error. Soooo....we shall see eh?
Although I read with interest I do lean toward these being false. I find them too wordy and the way they are worded does not feel divine to me. They almost seem like a recap of the world news with a hints of future events to keep people interested and coming back. They are too specific and too play by play. I also question the degree they name Putin as the great evil one in world events. Reading April 11th from Jesus (supposedly) I can't help but feel these are false. Our saviour and Lord rambling on about Ukraine and Russia like that just can't be really Him in my mind and heart. (*words below) So convoluted, wordy and rambling. This line does it for me...."Putin does not need a crystal ball" Jesus Christ. ***** Russia will surround the Ukraine with its darkness and its fire. The pressure will be intense. As the time goes on, cracks will appear in the Ukraine and divisions will take place. The Ukraine has various cultures, with ethnic groups and sub-divisions, almost too numerous to describe (due to the centuries of its history). Russia will apply its darkness by surrounding the Ukraine and keeping out the West. It will also apply its fire by the internal pressures that cause divisions. Very soon, many parts will appear and separate, all in different ways and in different degrees. Political unity will be shattered and its restoration will be impossible. New forms of political life will emerge. All will evolve into something new and all will be to Putin’s gain. How much he will gain, no one can foresee now, but he does not need a crystal ball. He needs only to apply the Russian darkness and the Russian fire. The Ukraine will self-divide because its political ties are already weak. Some regions will divide quickly and move politically out from under Kiev. Others will form a different relationship with Kiev. These first steps will not be the final steps. Larger sections of the Ukraine will move more slowly but their movement will shake the Ukraine even more. The final stage of the Ukraine will be hard to recognize, far removed from the political arrangement that formerly existed.
Like I said, I am still out on this watching from the top bleacher. Tone is very important in locutions, as are words. I find that we have to be careful because the education of the individual also has something to do with it. Look at the 'God Speaks, Will you listen?' messages with Cletis Scheffer? He was illiterate and although there were deep and profound messages there, his lack of education showed. Many times the only criteria for judging locutions is: Is there any doctrinal error? Does this make sense? Is the messenger a solid practicing Catholic sincere in their desire to serve God and the Church? We do have to be careful. After reading John Leary's messages for so long I finally threw them out with the compost. Too much. I could have written them if I had sat at the computer for 10 hrs. a day also! BUT...I do not doubt his sincerity to serve our Lord. He is a good man and daily communicant and has given his life to the Lord. The locutions.org messages are supposedly different from all others. She states that in the beginning!! I have read every single message from the beginning which gives me greater respect to how they have unfolded, what has come true, if there was anything that didn't come true etc. I am 'Taking what is good and throwing out what isn't' which is what scripture tells me to do.
The one thing I find about those messages, and I am saying this from memory so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, is that I see little to none of the call for prayer, repentance, fasting, the sacraments etc. that we have received in all the approved messages. The messages frustrate me because there is an awful lot of beating around the bush going on but I always feel that they are avoiding getting to the main point. That makes me suspect that the "messenger" is being careful not to over commit themselves lest they be caught out.
The messages frustrate me because there is an awful lot of beating around the bush going on but I always feel that they are avoiding getting to the main point Exactly Adoremus.
The hard part in all of this as that they are approved and backed by Msgr. Essef who is a very good and holy priest.
I had, for a time, believed in these messages, mainly because of the messages which spoke of the Pope who was about to be elected last year. But their political nature seemed increasingly incongruous to the extent that the more recent messages strike me as simply absurd if we are to believe they come from Our Lady. They would be fine if published in Time magazine but as words from the Mother of Jesus? I think not. I think Mgr Essef's problem will be that he has known the lady giving these messages for a considerable time and he clearly judged the early messages as authentic but there comes a time when it is difficult to extract yourself from something like this. I have been in a similar situation, promoting some messages that I was sure about initially and then found myself 'hooked' on them in a strange way before someone finally showed me the light. Looking back at the experience, I am amazed at how I was so convinced with what were most definitely false messages.
I voted no. Haven't read anything terrible in their content, but its just the play-by-play commentry on current events just seems so out of place. I don't think any other visionary had this type of commentry and so it seems these locutions stand out on their own. Medjugorie and garabandal never said "developments in country X caused by reason Y" with an update next week. But, as one poster said above, an accurate prophecy will cause me to re examine my opinion. One interesting factor is the spiritual director is (ive read) Mother Theresa's director, though Im open to correction there.
This position is probably the closest to my own regarding LTTW. On one hand there are some beautiful and counter-intuitive theological ideas in the earlier, more pedagogical messages which stopped me from dismissing them outright, but my impression was that as things went on, the balance has been lost. I'm for example not encouraged by what I feel to be a growing Mariocentrism in the language of some of the more recent material, whereas the earlier alleged locutions set Mary in a more classical Christological framework. So I really don't know what's happened, and without more information about Msgr Esseff's criteria for discernment it's difficult to comment. Part of the problem as I see it is also what I sense is a hunger on the part of readers of 'private revelation' for a true English-language locution to counter the obvious falsehoods of MDM. This has a certain logic to it, in that a counterfeit presupposes the existence of the real, but I feel that this has coloured folks' judgment somewhat. Looking at the bigger picture regarding currently active locutions, and particularly taking into account non-English language sources, in terms of a 'scale of certainty', LTTW in my opinion ranks fairly low. Well below Edson Glauber/Maria do Carmo, Sulema, Javier Viesca, Luz de Maria, Darly Chagas, Pedro Regis, Valentina Papagna and our own Verne Dagenais (restricting the discussion to sources where there is a substantial body of material which can be evaluated). Read in conjunction, a pretty consistent line emerges from all of these both with regard to theology and also the interpretation of world events. Just my reading of the situation; I could well be mistaken in my assessment of some of these alleged locutionaries, of course.
I too felt the messages surrounding the new pope to be intriging. They seem to annouce the change ahead of time. (although the evil one would have known also) Since then I've been reading and instead of being left feeling inspired, comforted, reassured I find a feeling of "discomfort" after. We are called to put God first and not become to engrossed in the world and worldly events, these loccutions seem to steer in an almost sensational way to worldly events. The greatest message Mary and Jesus brought in our time is the message of God's Divine Mercy. The great love God has for all and His willingness to forgive even the worse of sinners. I don't feel God's love and mercy coming from these words. I just read the latest, Safeguarding and Grassroots (I have read all) and Mary's almost desperate sounding desire to push these locutions out to the world is unsettling to say the least and the obsession with Putin and Russia is likewise unsettling. I think it's time for me to stop reading these and focus on messages of love, prayer, mercy and forgiveness. I am thankful I've found this forum though and look forward to reading/pratiscipating in other topics. There seems to be some great people on here. Peace and love.
Could it be that he has so much committed to these messages for a long time it would be very hard, very humbling to retreat now? Kinda like putting tooth paste back in the tube once it is out!
Hello MMM. Welcome to the forum. I am especially grateful to you for re-igniting interest in this thread with your first post. Your words express better than i can what i feel about LTTW. I have voted no. (Apologies: i had expected for us to be able to see how each of us voted, - as in other polls we have had in the forum - but i must have selected the wrong option.)
i was going to say i find it significant that not one member of the forum was willing to say that they thought LTTW authentic by voting yes. But then you spoil it The Cub. Shoot me down for reading it wrong but it is my opinion that those who are in the still discerning camp are discerning to eventually reject and not accept these locutions as authentic.
I have been strongly favorable to LTTW in the past, mainly in the first year of locutions. I found them very inspiring in that they addressed seemingly lost or desperate situations to then turn them into hope in a way that I think can come only from God. But there has been an evolution -as others have expressed it already- and although there were some question marks also in the past, regreatably I hear now, in these recent locutions, more of a voice similar to MDM than to the voice of hope I first found in them. The last series seem to me to try to "defroc" all trust in Pope Francis and the Church in such a subtle way that I can't think comes from God at all -while never asking to pray for him and her. Because of the personal credibility that surrounds the spiritual director -and the lack of obvious doctrinal errors, I think that this can be much more dangerous. Besides it's beginning to almost pretend that salvation will come only through this locutions ... Haven't we heard that before? On the other hand I still don't dare to dismiss completely, but I've increased my prayer for the Pope, the coming Synod on the family, and the Church -with a heavy heart, I have to say. I have often prayed for prophets and seers of our time. It must be so very challenging to live in two worlds the way they have to live, especially those who receive daily locutions/messages/apparitions. If they are not living a very demanding and austere form of discipleship, and working very seriously for their own sanctification -growth in virtue, especially humility- the risk to fall off the path is real, and the enemy is working against them with even more dedication, intent, and subtlety than he does on any of us ordinary sinners. I do believe that we need to pray more for the people involved in the topics we like to discuss here, and use the power of our prayer as a condiment that can influence what we often observe only as expectators. Lk 12:48 applies very much, I think, to us in this forum. We have received much and we will have to respond before God -on the the day of the Warning if not before- of our use of the knowledge and faith in Marian apparitions etc. How did we personally benefit from Heaven's messages to convert and grow in our personal journey of holiness? This is going to be something we will have to respond. Some weeks ago there was a message from Luz de Maria that stated precisely this kind of thing, allegedly Our Blessed Mother was saying that there are many people who know everything about messages and about the Warning but are unaware of how far from ready or prepared for it they are.
