The Mother of God.

Discussion in 'Mother of God' started by padraig, Dec 20, 2015.

  1. padraig

    padraig Powers

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  2. Basto

    Basto Guest

    Monstra te esse Matrem!
    Today, the 1st of January, the Octave (8th) day of Christmastide.
    View attachment 3988
    Statue of the Mother and Child, Annunciation Shrine, Bradford, UK

    The Solemnity of Mary, the Holy Mother of God is a feast day of the Blessed Virgin Mary under the aspect of her motherhood of Jesus Christ, whom Christians see as the Lord, Son of God.

    Mary's divine motherhood was proclaimed at the Council of Ephesus in 431.

    Various names are used to describe Mary's role as mother of Jesus. She is called "Mother of God" which translates the more accurately stated greek term "Theotokos" or "Birthgiver of God".

    The Council of Ephesus (431) attributed to Mary the title, Mother of God. This needs to be read against the Council's declaration that in Christ there are two natures, one divine and one human, but only one person. Indeed, according to the Council the holy virgin is the Mother of God since she begot according to the flesh the Word of God made flesh. This decision was further explained by the Council of Chalcedon (451) which says with regard to Mary's divine motherhood:

    "...begotten from the Father before the ages as regards his godhead, and in the last days, the same, because of us and because of our salvation begotten from the Virgin Mary, the Theotokos, as regards his manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only-begotten..."

    Mary's Divine Motherhood was not the object of an independent or exclusive dogmatic declaration. The statement is embedded in texts defining the person and natures of Jesus Christ. Thus, the dogma of Divine Motherhood becomes an integral part of the christological dogma. This does not diminish its definitive and binding character. The dogma of Divine Motherhood is generally accepted by all Christian denominations.

    View attachment 3989

    Today at St Joseph's Church, Bradford, UK

    A woman is a man’s mother either if she carried him in her womb or if she was the woman contributing half of his genetic matter or both. Mary was the mother of Jesus in both of these senses; because she not only carried Jesus in her womb but also supplied all of the genetic matter for his human body, since it was through her—not Joseph—that Jesus "was descended from David according to the flesh" (Rom. 1:3).

    Since Mary is Jesus’ mother, it must be concluded that she is also the Mother of God: If Mary is the mother of Jesus, and if Jesus is God, then Mary is the Mother of God. There is no way out of this logical syllogism, the valid form of which has been recognized by classical logicians since before the time of Christ.

    Although Mary is the Mother of God, she is not his mother in the sense that she is older than God or the source of her Son’s divinity, for she is neither. Rather, we say that she is the Mother of God in the sense that she carried in her womb a divine person—Jesus Christ, God "in the flesh" (2 John 7, cf. John 1:14)—and in the sense that she contributed the genetic matter to the human form God took in Jesus Christ.

    Today is truly the feast day of this Forum.
     
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  3. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    I went down to our local Parish Ulra Modern Church for mass today. Five priests said mass. I love the Feast of the Mother of God but for the first time thought little about Our Lady. This Church is oval and we sit staring at each other like a lot of Quakers.

    I was touched though by the big numbers who went, of all ages. I will continue to avoid this bowling alley hey call a church though.

    I noticed the new Parish Priest has replaced the very expensive modern art that no one could figure out with plain old fashioned traditional statues.

    Of course after mass no one prayed , it was like a crowd after a football match. An oval Church makes private prayer practically impossible.

    Rant over.

    Over and out.
     
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  4. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Ours i
    Ours is getting better. They put notice on the overhead asking people to be quiet and respectful. The worst offenders are the oldies like me.
     
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  5. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    I tried to upload a video of our church. We have one Our Lady of Lourdes in the front right hand corner and one in the courtyard and Our Lady of Akita in the foyer and a large portrait of Our Lady of Perpetual Succour next to the sacristy. In the front left corner is St Joseph and back left is the Sacred Heart next to the confessional and back right is the Little Flower. The stations are over 100 years old. Its a very btight and modern church but the old and new blend beautifully. We also have a long etched glass cartoon telling the story of St Joseph and a stain glass window of Our Lady Untier of Knots. The other stained glass windows are contemporary but very tasteful and wonderfully symbolic of the faith like the vine and the wheat and the lamb and intertwined wedding rings. We have two etchched glass windows for St John XXIII and St John Paul II. Aren't we blessed. And our tabernacle is front and centre under a huge traditional wooden crucifix.
     
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  6. padraig

    padraig Powers

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    amazing you have Our Lady of Akita, I would love that
     
  7. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Thats the one I commissioned on my return from Akita. People presume I was just grateful because I survived the car crash but, like Maximillian Kolbe, it was really just Her utter beauty that inspired in me a need to have Her here and share Her with my parish.
     
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  8. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Here She is. If you zoom in on Her podium you will see Her three titles.
     
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  9. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Tonight I went to the vigil mass for the Epiphany as part of my 5 first Saturdays. So I will be going to mass tomorrow too. Apart from this double blessing I also heard of the death of Fr Dan who died on New Years day. Fr Dan was a successful athlete in his youth especially in the 440 yard sprint. He told me such tales whenever he heard my confession. He enjoyed a beer and once I left a couple of cases for him after a paricularly good session in the box. He was ordained a priest in his native Fiji. After twenty years he obtained permission to leave his ministry. After leaving he met and married his beloved Monica. They had no children and she died 20 years later. Fr Dan contacted his Bishop and asked if he could return to holy orders. His bishop gave him his blessing and reinstated him immediately. Obviously he had been held in high regard and had been sorely missed. While back in ministry he met Bishop Dennis from Auckland who subsequently asked for him to serve his diocese. And so Fr Dan came to New Zealand. He said mass every morning at 6.30 and always gave a homily, never from notes. He was a holy and a learned priest who spoke gently but clearly and kept things simple. I will miss his wonderful ministry of reconciliation. I did not know that for all the time he was here he was ill. About 5 or 6 weeks ago it was really obvious. He died with cancer. Now he is with God and his lovely Monica.
    The priest tonight talked about the Way and the two ways offered in the Didache and how the Epiphany was the Showing of Christ and how this showing changed the Magi so they reurned by a different Way. He talked about how portraits of Mary often show her holding out Jesus in one hand and showing him effortlessly to the world. He said this was no tiny baby but a well developed heavy child and was not due to poor artistic perspective but was deliberately symbolic. He said we have to strive for this effortless showing of Christ by becomming more and more like Him through His Way. He said we cannot give what we do not have.
    When I was in Akita I encountered some amazing volunteers helping the victims of tsunami. They were led by a young French priest. They sang like angels. I fell a little in love with one of these angels but she was so focused on her mission she cut that off at the roots. When the volunteers left she gave me a card she had made with Japanese characters on it in her own hand. They had all learned to speak and write Japanese and they read and sung Gregorian chant in harmony. Perhaps they really were angels. She wrote a translation of the Japanese on the back of the card. It said,
    "Jesus said, "I am with you always, until the end of the age." Matthew 28-20.
    ...may you always show the other the sign of God.
    God bless you
    Stephanie

    For me this was another Epiphany.
     
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  10. josephite

    josephite Powers

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    Hail Mary! my Mother

    Hail Mary! my Queen

    Hail Mary! my Mediatrix
    -----------------------------------------------

    Thank you!

    I love you!

    Help me always and in everything!

    Please Dearest Mother, tell Jesus Thy Incarnate Son of God, that ,.......... I love Him!

    And that I am sorry that I have offended Him.

    Lord have mercy.
    Christ have mercy.
    Lord have mercy.


    Mother of Mercy

    Pray for me and all those of the Mother of God forum and our families. Amen.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2016
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  11. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    "I love a sunburnt country,
    A land of sweeping plains,
    Of ragged mountain ranges,
    Of droughts and flooding rains.
    I love her far horizons,
    I love her jewel sea,
    Her beauty and her terror,
    The wide brown land for me."
    By Dorothea Mackellar.
    On Australia.
    St Mary McKillop pray for us.
    I believe Our Lady has a special place under her mantle and in her heart for Anzac Catholics. We are way down here out of sight and out of mind but not to Jesus and His Mother. Our Mother. If you look at the statue of Our Lady of Akita posted above you will see Australia under her feet. When I commisioned this statue this was a point of difference from the original whose globe was blank. May we always be at her feet, under her care.
    I see Dorothea died on January 14 1968. She was baptised in 1885 in All Saints Anglican Church Sydney. R.I.P.
     
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  12. kathy k

    kathy k Guest

  13. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Jesus carried his Blessed Mother's DNA and with the rest of Him this was glorified when He went to heaven. But it took Her DNA to bring God Made Man to earth in the first place and on earth Jesus carried Mary's DNA. By this He could be identified as Her Son. We receive the glorified Body and Blood of Jesus in Communion. Does that mean we receive the glorified DNA of Mary too. How could we not? It is part of Him. If so, there we have another reason to proclaim His Blessed Mother Co-Redemptrix. "Unless you eat My flesh and drink my blood you cannot have life eternal in you." No wonder we go through Mary to Jesus. Jesus came through Mary to us. By denying the Real Presence man denies and defiles Mary in all her Magnificence and in Her Mission. No wonder God becomes angry when His Mother is insulted and man is condemned when he receives unworthily. Mary had to be Immaculate to carry Jesus but unrepentant man receives Him while in the filth of mortal sin.
    If this is heresy it is unintentional. Those who are qualified please put me right. We were told quite clearly from Amsterdam that the title Co-redemptorix does not claim equality with God in his saving work but confirms that Mary was with him in this work all the Way. She is the Mother of The Way.
     
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  14. josephite

    josephite Powers

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    Thank you Joe.
    Beautiful!
    St Mary McKillop pray for us.

    Oh Foundress of the josephites!

    Pray for all in Australia and in New Zealand as we are Brothers in arms and in Love!

    Long live the Anzac tradition!

    God Bless us all!!!!
     
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  15. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Mac's lovely wife is a relative of St Mary McKillop. His father-in-law told me about their connection at Christmas.
     
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  16. Blue Horizen

    Blue Horizen Guest

    Sounds unlikely theologically (and perhaps biologically) to me Joe but I like your sentiments all the same (y).
    BTW did you know that a little of baby's DNA apparently passes into mum? That makes for a lot of reflection too!
     
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  17. Blue Horizen

    Blue Horizen Guest

    [​IMG]
    Some early Quakers :D.
     
  18. miker

    miker Powers

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    I was at a talk a few years ago where this came up. Science has a technical term called fetal microchimerism which is the passing of the babies DNA into the mother

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/32678/title/Swapping-DNA-in-the-Womb/

    To me what is fascinating and again illustrates the brilliance of our Holy Roman Catholic Church is this to me proves the dogma of the Assumption of Mary body and soul into Heaven. How could her body which had part of Jesus' divine nature ever face corruption? It couldn't. And to think that the Church declared this Dogma back in 1950 long before genetic science was even established. But even well before that time, any a Church Fathers proclaimed the Assumption of Mary. Really remarkable.
     
  19. Joe Crozier

    Joe Crozier Guest

    Brilliantly argued Blue, I dont' think. It seems your ignorance of genetics is only surpassed by your deficit in thelogical logic and your mis-understanding of sentiment. You can do better than "bollocks"? Shame. With comments like that you will give Kiwi minds a bad name. I can almost hear the banjoes and the words "my folks were cousins but I'm ok."
     
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  20. Blue Horizen

    Blue Horizen Guest

    Good one Miker.
    Do you know of any articles that say the same sort of thing wrt husband and wife?
    I have always found it interesting that longtime faithful partners are often compatible when it comes to organ donation which odds are highly unusual.
    It seems becoming one flesh is literally true also.
     
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